Abortion!

[Shoden]

Nothing wrong with it, I don't know why a bunch of human rights psychos protest about freedom of choice.


It's up to the Woman not doctors, nurses, surgeons or psychos.

[Traitorfish]

OK, Cait Sith, you're one sick monkey. Showing mutilated corpses doesn't prove you're point or make you more right (although maybe more right-wing), it makes you an exploitative sicko!!!
Exploitative, yes. You're exploiting these dead babies to force you're chauvanistic, fascist veiws onto everyone else.
[Fascist- Believes that they are better than everyone else and can force their self-righteous veiws down everyone else's throat]

The only real pro-life argument is that it kills a potential life. It is no more alive than a fungus, let alone that pig you had for lunch. But, using contraceptives ends potential lives. In fact, not having sex at all ends potential lives. So, any situation in which women are not constantly pregnant is 'murder'. Admittedly, that is precisely the opinion of the Catholic Church, but that doesn't justify such sick chauvanism (has any else notced how so many pro-life campaigners are male?).
What I never understand is why it's the pro-life right-wingers who approve the murder of criminals, communists, muslims, foreigners, and anyone else at all 'un-american'. Can you explain this? I don't see how an 8-year old, fullt an unqestionably alive Iraqi child has less right to life than a six-week old, unformed blob of cells.

As for my stance on abortion, I put it in the 'Erm...' pile. I don't think peope should do it (put that down to my catholic up-bringing), but I don't think it's my place to tell them. Other things in this pile are marijuana, alcohol and over-eating. I can point out waht they're doing wrong, or voice my opinion, but I can't always force my views down everyone else's throats.
Although, abortions after the first trimester are sick, naughty, evil and wrong. By the time it's a feoutus, it's too late to kill it. That's just plain wrong. (In the UK abortion is only legal in the first trimester.)

[*__*)]

My abortion pics were taken down, ah well, just google it if you want to see it for yourself, I'll admit that it is too gruesome to be seen here or anywhere. But never ever be afraid to see the truth, now matter how disturbing it is

OK, Cait Sith, you're one sick monkey. Showing mutilated corpses doesn't prove you're point or make you more right (although maybe more right-wing), it makes you an exploitative sicko!!!

Traitorfish, how dare you!

Exploitative, yes. You're exploiting these dead babies to force you're chauvanistic, fascist veiws onto everyone else.
[Fascist- Believes that they are better than everyone else and can force their self-righteous veiws down everyone else's throat]

Hmm........................................

The only real pro-life argument is that it kills a potential life. It is no more alive than a fungus, let alone that pig you had for lunch. But, using contraceptives ends potential lives.

Life: The property or quality that distinguishes living organisms from dead organisms and inanimate matter, manifested in functions such as metabolism, growth, reproduction, and response to stimuli or adaptation to the environment originating from within the organism.
........Fetus' can do those things, except for reproduse, but even children as old as 10 can't do that.

In fact, not having sex at all ends potential lives. So, any situation in which women are not constantly pregnant is 'murder'. Admittedly, that is precisely the opinion of the Catholic Church, but that doesn't justify such sick chauvanism (has any else notced how so many pro-life campaigners are male?).
What I never understand is why it's the pro-life right-wingers who approve the murder of criminals, communists, muslims, foreigners, and anyone else at all 'un-american'. Can you explain this? I don't see how an 8-year old, fullt an unqestionably alive Iraqi child has less right to life than a six-week old, unformed blob of cells.

Although I am strongly pro-life and consider myself right-wing, I never ever aprove the murder of anyone, I actually have a thread here about the death penalty in which I am against it as a means of punishment.

As for my stance on abortion, I put it in the 'Erm...' pile. I don't think peope should do it (put that down to my catholic up-bringing), but I don't think it's my place to tell them. Other things in this pile are marijuana, alcohol and over-eating. I can point out waht they're doing wrong, or voice my opinion, but I can't always force my views down everyone else's throats.
Although, abortions after the first trimester are sick, naughty, evil and wrong. By the time it's a feoutus, it's too late to kill it. That's just plain wrong. (In the UK abortion is only legal in the first trimester.)

I didn't know that. I agree with you, it is just plain wrong.

[eestlinc]

We can't have those pictures on this forum, as it is both at -least-somewhat family oriented, and also many of us view the site at school or work where such content could be problematic.

[Traitorfish]

My abortion pics were taken down, ah well, just google it if you want to see it for yourself, I'll admit that it is too gruesome to be seen here or anywhere. But never ever be afraid to see the truth, now matter how disturbing it is

You're talking rubbish. You can't just show shocking pictures. That's cowardly- "Oh look! Icky! I'm right! Hurrah!"
Besides, those pictures were disturbing. If you'd used links with fair warning, fair enough, but you can't soil our beloved forum with your grossness.
OK, in answer to you're stuff (you can't work quotes):
You're being over precise. Besides, kids can re-produce. Their cells re-produce. That counts.
But, I value the rights of living people more than the theoretical rights of potential people. For example, the people that were never even conceived. I don't value them. Does that mean I approve of murder?

We can't have those pictures on this forum, as it is both at -least-somewhat family oriented, and also many of us view the site at school or work where such content could be problematic.

Thanks.

[Yooniece]

Hah. Pandora's Box.

Regardless of what I personally feel about terminating a potential life, I, and everyone else in this thread, has no jurisdiction over what a woman can or cannot do with her body. Ultimately, it is her choice, and even if she is legally prevented in obtaining an abortion in a clinic, she still can find a way to scrape that fetus out of her. I'd rather offer that freedom, along with the morality issues that go along with it (which is that person's burden/responsibility to deal with) than try to repress and imprison a woman's choice within her own body.

[*__*)]

We can't have those pictures on this forum, as it is both at -least-somewhat family oriented, and also many of us view the site at school or work where such content could be problematic.

My next topic for discussion: The problem with censorship

[Faris]

I don't really care. People can do whatever they want.

[nik0tine]

At this moment in time I do not feel that it is right to illegalize abortion. However, abortions should NOT be carried out by the state.

And am I the only one who thinks that a 14 year old girl should NOT be required to inform her folks about her abortion? If she's getting one, I don't see a problem with her parents not knowing.

[Spiffing Cheese]

I think it's quite hard to have a true opinion on abortion - the fact is, you don't know whether you'd have the same opinion you do now if you found yourself in a situation where abortion was an option.

I don't really have a problem with abortion.

[Lenna]

I believe that abotion is there for certain purpose. When abused it is wrong.

I know that some people make mistakes, but others dont. If they are in an education which they have chosen to do by free will, then they should be given the opportunity to continue that education. Punishing them by making them have a baby, miss college/uni/school for the purpose of a baby, when they don't want it, is hardly fair. Regardless of the circumstances.

Everyone makes mistakes sometimes, but when a baby comes along, it's there for life. Even in adoption. If you keep the baby you have to experience the struggle of 9 months with your education (education is my main view atm) Where as with an abortion at an early stage you have the chance to choose when you want to have a family in your life. Forcing someone to have a baby is unfair. Even with adoption it's still there for that amount of time.

[Rye]

Eh, I'm pro-choice (you know, in case of rape and if the person is really young), but I wouldn't do it myself, I wouldn't be able to live with it.

[*__*)]

I know there are people who don't have opinions and don't really care. But did any of you know that there have been more than a few people who have actually survived their abortions? I found this one online, in it she says "I am happy to be alive. I almost died. Every day I thank God for life."

I think you may have an oppinion after you read about some people who have survived abortion.

http://members.aol.com/doublemynt/survivor.html

It's unfair not to let someone like this live.

[Raistlin]

Partial-birth abortion is wrong, yes - when the baby is capable of living on its own. That doesn't mean abortion in the first trimester is.

[Sasquatch]

Remembered what else I wanted to say.

Before abortions were legalized women still got abortions from backstreet abortionists, this could kill not only the baby, but it could sterilize or even kill the mother too, as women often got infections.

My opinion is, if they try to kill somebody else, they take the chance of having something bad happen to them, like such infections, sterilization, etc. If I try to enter your house and attack you, and you hurt me, I have no right to complain because I got what was coming to me. It's that simple.

OK, Cait Sith, you're one sick monkey. Showing mutilated corpses doesn't prove you're point or make you more right (although maybe more right-wing), it makes you an exploitative sicko!!!

Shock value.

Exploitative, yes. You're exploiting these dead babies to force you're chauvanistic, fascist veiws onto everyone else.

Just as you're exploiting these "poor" or "victimized" or "unfortunate" women who are "burdened" withan unwanted pregnancy to "force" your views of the acceptance of child murder onto everyone else. A pot and a kettle come to mind.

[Fascist- Believes that they are better than everyone else and can force their self-righteous veiws down everyone else's throat]

"Fascist" has become a liberal keyword to use against anybody they disagree with, so you're not winning anything there. (Typically, if you back them into a corner enough with facts and they're really losing, they'll bring out "nazi".) And just as anybody does (or does not) "force their self-righteous views down everyone else's throat", you do the same, by trying to force everybody to accept YOUR view of such topics like abortion, capital punishment, etc.

The only real pro-life argument is that it kills a potential life.

Actually, no, you're wrong -- there are plenty of pro-life arguments, including father's rights, molestation and incest hiding, and the obvious danger of abortions. And, no, most pro-lifers agree that it's not killing potential life, it's taking life. And even if you don't think an unborn child is alive, it WILL BE. It doesn't have the "potential", it will become a living person, given time. Even if you don't believe unborn children are alive -- first of all, you have a demented meaning of "alive", but second of all -- you can't compare it to, say, a vehicle in the middle of an assembly line, because in nine months that vehicle will still be there, half-finished, waiting for something to be done. That's still only if you would degrade human life enough to compare it with an automobile.

It is no more alive than a fungus

Actually, fungi are alive. Try again.

but that doesn't justify such sick chauvanism (has any else notced how so many pro-life campaigners are male?).

Bringing out the "male chouvanism" line? That didn't take long. And by the way, there are countless pro-life campaigners that are female, including women who've had abortions. It strikes closer to home for females, obviously.

What I never understand is why it's the pro-life right-wingers who approve the murder of criminals, communists, muslims, foreigners, and anyone else at all 'un-american'. Can you explain this?

First of all, we "eeeevil right-wingers" don't "approve of the murder of criminals, communists, muslims, foreigners, and anyone else at all 'un-american'[sic]". Second of all, there's a difference between killing and murdering.

I don't see how an 8-year old, fullt an unqestionably alive Iraqi child has less right to life than a six-week old, unformed blob of cells.

A.) By six weeks, the "blob of cells" has form, basic body function, and a heartbeat.
B.) 8-year-old Iraqi children aren't targetted, and measures are taken, sometimes by endangering more American lives, to prevent innocent casualties in every situation.
C.) Even if Iraqi children were targetted, there have been exponentially more abortions than Iraqi children killed during OIF.