My Thoughts on Advent Children

[Masamune·1600]

You may have noticed that several people have already dissected your "review" quite thoroughly. I'm also going to do so, however, because none of the previous rebuttals actually fully analyzed your mistaken views on the plot, both of Advent Children and the original game.

There's nothing wrong with disliking FFVII, or Advent Children, or any additional facet of the Compilation of FFVII. However, your criticisms are almost wholly grounded in misconceptions, so I'll attempt to correct such misunderstandings as they arise in your "review."

I didnt like Advent Children for several reasons.

First of all, Im not really all that big a fan of the original FFVII. Sure it was a okay game, some points it was even great, but the game, the story and its characters, the music, and the overall challenge and design were all a step beneath the prior Final Fantasy, FFVI. When I first saw sepherioth, with his seven foot sword, girlish smile, bishonen long hair and V-neck leather I declared and prayed to the heavens not to let him be a main character. My outrage knew no bounds that he was the main villain, and its not just the fact that he looks like his life motto is "dont ask, dont tell" in every way possible he is inferior to characters like Eperor Geshtal who was so evil he slit the throat of a already dying woman just to kidnap her baby and turn the child into a living weapon, and kefka who needs no introduction.

Kefka and Emperor Gestahl were adequate villains in their own right, but certainly wouldn't have suffered from a little more backstory. Sephiroth, for his part, has compex motives and an incredibly involved backstory. Kefka also has something of a "flamboyant" appearance, since that seems to bother you so much. This isn't, again, to criticize Gestahl or Kefka as characters, but your criticisms carry little weight when delivered in such a diatribe as the one quoted above.

Then there was cloud, unlike most the cross dressing thing didnt really bother me considering it was done as a huge joke. Its just the fact that they gave him this badass mystique, revealed him to be a wimp, then tried to tell us that him, as a Final Fantasy equivelant to a rent-a-cop could withdraw a sword from his own midsection, and hurl the holder (by the point of his own sword no less) down a chasam was really pushing it. Then there was clouds moaning, weeping, angsty creed-like dialouge that often struck me as being beneath final fantasy considering how weighty the first six games had been.

Sephiroth's Masamune, in all likelihood, had pierced his shoulder, and not his "midsection." The entire point of that sequence was to explore Sephiroth's primary reason for desiring to antagonize Cloud, and to show what had really happened during the Nibelheim disaster. Cloud, given his inherent abilities, and the sheer anger that would have been directed at Seph at that point, was able to hurl him into the depths of the reactor.

I'm not sure how you can characterize the "first six games" as particularly weighy by criticizing the dialogue of FFVII (which, for its part, was not translated particularly well). The Light Warriors of FFI didn't even have dialogue. FFIV (originally released in the US as FFII) also suffered from bad (actually, worse) translation.

Even as is, Cloud's "angsty" speech isn't so much "angsty" as it is a commonly perpetuated stereotype.

Im not exactly the biggest fan of FFVII. But I do give it its props. But Advent Children was almost a complete vaccum of quality, filled instead with contrivance, idiocy, lost potential and redundancy. Lets take the animation values for starters. Watch much Hong Kong action flicks or anime? I do. and I found Advent Childrens animation and fight scenes to be very redundant of both. The whole flying and leaping thing can be compared to Such anime as Dragon Ball Z or such Wuxia flicks as Crouching Tiger Hidden Dragon or hero. Ditto for the fight scenes and special powers as well. Also I found that alot of times the action in Advent Children felt wooden, like I was watching a puppet show or something. I wasnt expecting animation values on the level of Spritis Within (which by the way I feel is an immensely superior film, and a infinitely inferior final fantasy product) but c'mon at some points the action just felt so awful, like something out of a 1,000,000 dollar man episode.

While this element is, of course, your own opinion (although I completely disagree with your assessment of the influences of the AC action), you remain the only reviewer out of the many I've seen that has criticized the action/fight sequences.

It's a problem on your end, really.

Then there was the main character. Not characters, that would insinuate there was more then one. As soon as the film finished its rather boring ten minute long recap of the game (can anyone tell me what was the point of us seeing the ending of the game again at the beginning?) the film focused on cloud. And even IF I found cloud to be a likeable character (which I dont) didnt the moody mook sort out his psychosis back in the game? Why am I watching this looser work through his loneliness and bi-polar issues again? I had enough of it halfway through the game, I didnt need another hit while watching him do his best impression of Li Mu bai.

Time for some analysis.

The ending of FFVII was deliberately and profoundly ambiguous. The scene depicting Red XIII, which took place 500 years after the game, revealed that Gaia had survived, in spite of Bugenhagen's ominous predictions.

Cloud: ......When the planet dies?

Bugenhagen: Ho Ho Hoooo. It may be tomorrow, or 100 years from now... But it's
not long off.

and

Bugenhagen: Listen, Nanaki. Cloud says they are trying to save the planet.
Honestly, I don't think it can be done. For even if they stop every reactor on
the planet, it's only going to postpone the inevitable. Even if they stop
Sephiroth, everything will perish. But, Nanaki. I've been thinking lately. I've
been thinking if there was anything WE could do, as a part of the planet,
something to help a planet already in misery... No matter what happens, isn't it
important to try? Am I just wishing against fate? I am too old to do something
about it... This year, you must go with them! For my sake.

However, while AVALANCHE proved successful in its ultimate goal, and saved Gaia, the individual fates of the characters, and even humanity itself, were left unrevealed. That being said, Advent Children serves as the primary vehicle to explore those mysteries.

However, the fact remains that the "500 years later" ending did take place. Hence, AC reminds us of the ultimate success of the characters, while recalling FFVII and moving us into the actual events of the movie.

As to the matter of Marlene's retelling, it was a way to convey what had happened in the two years between FFVII and AC. Unless one has read Kazushige Nojima's novella On the Way to a Smile, which you evidently haven't, this sequence is necessary to introduce the phenomenon of Geostigma. Given that Geostigma is the most important new element introduced in the film, Marlene's recap is essentially necessary.

Cloud's "mood[iness]," as you put it, is primarily a consequence of certain events which took place between FFVII and AC, detailed in the "Case of Tifa" in the aforementioned On the Way to a Smile. Moreover, it's not so much moodiness as guilt; while Cloud's issues in the original game were derivative of his screwed-up identity, his character "flaws" in AC deal with his inability to deal with the deaths of those close to him, especially Aeris. The movie makes this clear, although the background can be found in the novella.

Oh, and I'd imagine having what was thought to be an invariably fatal illness is probably pretty depressing as well.

Then there was Tifa. Now Tifa may not have exactly embodied the essence of strong willed leading women in the game, but she did have her moments. Here she does nothing but serves as a punching bag for Loz and then acts as clouds cheerleader for the rest of the film. I love the scene where yuffie just gives her a sneer and comments on how stupid cloud is behaving. If Tifa had a backbone in this film, she'd slap him, throw a glass of cold water in his face and tell him to get off his his self pitying ass and get something done.

Again, the dynamics of Cloud and Tifa's relationship is explicated in the "Case of Tifa," although you're basically the only person who faults her in-film character, even without resort to that pivotal novella. Tifa cares about Cloud, but understands that he needs to make his decisions for himself (recalling a critical motif from the original game). For her part, Tifa does encourage Cloud to "[do] something" after the two wake up in Seventh Heaven (having been brought back by Rude and Reno).

I'll finish my character asassination by commenting on the viallains. First of all could Kadaj had been any more boring? Maybe at the school of redundant bishonen acting 101, they teach you to dress in leather, say ambiguous villain talk and lather, rinse, repeat. But I do like my main villains to actually, you know, get something done or make a lick of sense. His master plan of kidnapping midgars children to turn them into his own cult of suicidal zombie ninja commadoes reminded of this one episode of GI Joe where cobra commander takes over a preschool and tries to make a class of 8 year olds into a crack commando team. (Except GI Joe did it better). And when you take your lessons in villainy from a lame 80's villain with a lisp, you suck. End of story. I know he's just a shell who's only purpose in life is to bring seph back, but I would have liked for him to be a bit more likeable. And when seph does come back, I was so bored. (Hey seph, you infect the planet and the human race with a disease made up of your conciousness, plan this elaborate resurrection scheme, and you dont know what your gonna do next? Can we just get Cobra Commander to be the villain next film? At least he had backup plans). All seph did was prance around, talk the ambigious stereotypical villain talk, and die. What was the point?

Basically everything you said in this entire paragraph, from the perspective of the FFVII story and mythology, is wrong.

First off, Kadaj's master plan had nothing to do with any sort of suicide cult whatever the hell you were trying to say. Kidnapping the children brought together several key points. In addition to reestablishing the underlying themes of the movie, it allowed the SHM to lure Cloud to the Forgotten City. Moreover, as the children were afflicted with Geostigma, they were, really, kin to the SHM. Since Geostigma involves JENOVA, this also ties into the concept of again bringing about the Reunion. Still further, the children, ostensibly, could have been used to help locate the "head of JENOVA" once they had been infused by Kadaj's will.

Kadaj, for his part, is a rather complicated villain (actually, given his motives and "salvation," he somewhat reminds me of Kuja). Ignoring the incredibly complex Kabballistic symbolism inherent to FFVII and AC (and here Kadaj, whose name is derived from Kaddish [a Jewish prayer of mourning], can be better understood), one should appreciate what he actually was. Like Loz and Yazoo, Kadaj was a Remnant of Sephiroth, meaning he (and the other two SHM) were formed when Sephiroth's body was blown apart at the end of FFVII. As such, he carries with him the will to do the desire of his "mother," JENOVA, incapable of realizing that the wills of JENOVA and Sephiroth (an individual who, ironically, Kadaj doesn't understand) are essentially inseparable.

For the part of Sephiroth, he wasn't exactly resurrected, as he cannot truly die while JENOVA cells still exist. Presumably, the original biological material that comprised him has been eliminated (given the deaths of the SHM), but his will, in conjunction with the shapechanging aspect of JENOVA cells, can still take on and manifest a physically identical Sephiroth form. In this way, Sephiroth can be destroyed (repeatedly), but only actually be eliminated when JENOVA is also eliminated.

Also, as previously mentioned, Sephiroth knows exactly what he plans to do next. The Spirit Energy of those who die with Geostigma is contaminated; such Spirit Energy effectively creates what might be called a "Negative Lifestream." In time, this Negative Lifestream might actually overcome the Gaian Lifestream, giving Seph control over the planet. Moreover, it could then be used as a vehicle to travel the universe, simultaneously bringing about Sephiroth's own plan and the ultimate, immutable goal of the viruslike JENOVA.

I'll tell you what the point was, and its Advent Childrens main flaw, it wasnt so much that it was a movie as it was a huge fanwank on square's most internationally successful title. Say what you will about spirits within, but whats the most common complaint about it? "It shouldnt have been called Final fantasy" is what the gaming crowd say about it. "It didnt even star any Final Fantasy characters". Gag me with a spoon for cyrin out loud, Sakaguchi and square work bloody hard to bring a legitamately intelligent and well thought out video game movie to theatres, and the video game crowd turned up their noses just because it didnt feature any moody bishonen? This is why video game movies since then suck, but make money. So yah, square took the rought of Super Mario Bros and the live action street fighter. It threw in every piece of Final Fantasy VII fanservice it could think of, and nothing else. Thats Advent Childrens greatest strength, and greatest weakness. Here's just a few examples of how most of the plot makes little to no sense.

While I agree that The Spirits Within was both an excellent and underrated title, I find it ironic that you praise the movie when it basically shared the same key themes as FFVII (which you bashed earlier in your post).

Obviously, given everything I mentioned above (which you, apparently, missed), there was much more to Advent Children than simply the tenets of fanservice. I can't imagine that anyone would actually go so far as to compare AC to Super Mario Bros.

Kadaj kidnaps and brainwashes midgars children, then just has them stand around waiting for bahamut to kill them. What was the point of kidnapping them then?

Um, in addition to the numerous reasons presented above, they also effectively kept the populace from interrupting Loz and Yazoo as they attempted to tear down the memorial (where they thought the head of JENOVA was being kept).

Moreover, Kadaj summoned Bahamut TREMOR for two reasons, neither of which even involved the children. First, it was able to do what Loz and Yazoo hadn't; demolish the memorial. It then looked through the rubble for the "head of JENOVA," which wasn't there. Further, given the destruction that Bahamut TREMOR could inflict on Edge, Kadaj hoped to force Rufus' hand and make him reveal the location of the "head of JENOVA."

Cloud moaps for most of the film, and one pep talk from vincent later he's on top of the world? Give me a break.

Cloud's guilt is washed away when he discovers that penance is possible. Of course, he's blaming himself for things that aren't really his fault in the first place, but having the burden of multiple deaths (Aeris, Zack, etc.) washed away would be a relief for anyone. Coming to terms with the death of someone close to you, especially when you were in some way involved, can be difficult. The removal of such a burden would certainly be freeing; one might also look to Ramza in Final Fantasy Tactics during the battle at Golgorand Execution Site.

I understand kadaj was a shell for sepherioth's thoughts and power. But what was the origin and point for the other two? It would have made more sense if all three stored a part of sepherioth. One the intellect, another the power, and the other the magic. That would have made so much more sense, and added to sephs coolness (what little there is) on the princible that no one human shell could contain his combined ability. As it was, the other two were just utterly pointless and served little real point to the plot.

Um, clearly you didn't understand what Kadaj was, as all three SHM actually were Remnants of Sephiroth. At the end of FFVII, when Sephiroth's body was blown apart, it reformed into the three SHM. All three SHM inherently felt the need for "Reunion;" in this case, the term ultimately means fusing the divided consciousness and biological material of Sephiroth (the SHM) with JENOVA cells. This would allow Sephiroth to effectively again manifest himself on Gaia.

In any case, Sephiroth clearly transcended the SHM, as they were mere aspects of him in the first place, and were subjects of his will. One might also note how much more powerful Sephiroth was than Kadaj, the leader and most powerful of the three "brothers." And even the "lesser" SHM, Loz and Yazoo, are extremely powerful; notice how easily Loz was able to defeat Tifa, a supremely gifted fighter in her own right.

The entire final fantasy cast is busy doing their own business, but bahamut shows up and they all coincidently just happen to be in the same neighborhood? Yah right convenient, couldnt they have done a bit more besides cheer on cloud?

The scene at the pool in the Forgotten City showed various messages from the members of AVALANCHE; these messages had been saved, and showed that all the party members retained an interest in Cloud, Tifa, and the goings-on in Midgar/Edge. Obviously, the means of communication existed, and Cid's new airship, the Sierra (or Shera, if previous translation is to be reflected) would have provided a means of quick transportation (also note that Yuffie parachutes in, just as the party parachuted into Midgar in the original game). Barret and Vincent, moreover, would have had particular reason to come to Midgar; Barret was known to be coming, to see Marlene, and Vincent was already aware of what was happening. Consequently, he arrived almost at the same time as Cloud.

Then there was the ending, They should have just let cloud DIE. Instead the lifestream brings him back. AGAIN! isnt this like the third time the lifestream has brought a dead person back? first seph when cloud throws him into the chasam, then clould when the crater collapses, then in this film. Seems there is so much traffic going through the lifestream these days they oughtta just build a subway terminal going through it. Would be alot less contrived.

This paragraph, more than anything else, is why I've been so critical. No one has ever been "resurrected" by the Lifestream. Sephiroth had nothing to do with the Lifestream, as he is inherently opposed to it (JENOVA, Geostigma, the Negative Lifestream, you get the idea). However, as he had essentially merged with JENOVA on a physical level, he is endowed with many of the qualities of JENOVA; particularly, the fact that JENOVA's (and therefore Sephiroth's) cells remain alive even when separated. As such, his partially destroyed body could still be manifested as he pleased.

Cloud wasn't revived by the Lifestream; nothing physical even happened at the end of FFVII. The final battle between Cloud and Sephiroth took place in Cloud's mind, as evidenced by the fact that Cloud never moved from that ledge. Rather, as Cloud bore JENOVA cells, it was Sephiroth's last effort to control things before his complete defeat. Cloud, whose will was strengthened immeasurably by the realization and acceptance of his own identity, was able to easily repell this last effort by Seph.

Cloud's experience at the end of AC was more in the nature of a near death experience. Moreover, Cloud had been able to communicate with Aeris thorughout the movie, even when not in a position of near-death, and Aeris was clearly able to manifest her will throughout the movie (the healing of Geostigma, and so forth). Aeris might have used the Lifestream to help heal Cloud, but she could not have resurrected him. This is intrinsically opposed to the cyclical nature of the Lifestream, after all.

If resurrection was possible, Aeris might just as well have brought back herself and Zack. And Biggs, Wedge, Jessie, and whatever other characters one would like to see alive.

And I really dont think we needed to see Aerieth and Zack at the end. They were more then just visiting spirits seeing as how Aerieth was tending too a sick child, and yes it answered the question as too who she loved, but It was still really pointless besides to give those idiots who still write poetry over her death a cheap thrill.

This scene served several purposes. Beyond its symbolic nature, it was a fanservice, but not the one you suggest. Rather, it recalls the infamous "Aeris' ghost in the church" glitch in FFVII, where Aeris can be seen near the children by the flowers in the original game. More importantly, it represented Aeris' part in everything from the beginning, as well as her central role in healing the children, and also showed her finally moving away from Gaia.

Even ignoring this, there's no reason in and of itself that this scene should bother you.

Then there was the beginning. You know, I want to be at the meeting where nomura pitched that idea. "Okay, wait for this, I have a BRILLIANT idea. I see Advent Children beginning.... with the same cinema that ENDED the Game! Ah, I am a Genius." Odds are the sheer fanboyish stupidity of that idea would trace the root of the rumored mental collapse of FFXII's initial director.

This has no point, other than to be sarcastic. It's not even a real criticism, just a rant.

Reno and Rude's fight with the seph clones was great.

Calling the SHM Sephiroth Clones is just...wrong. Sephiroth Clones are humans who have been injected with JENOVA cells and infused with Mako. In particular, the CLONES are the survivors of the Nibelheim disaster, who were given JENOVA therapy by Hojo, and were seen in the game as black-garbed individuals with no free will.

The SHM, as repeatedly mentioned, were formed from the very body of Sephiroth. By FFVII terminology, they have nothing even to do with the Sephiroth Clones.

Seeing them get in their licks after insulting jenova was priceless, and just the sheer antics from Rude always carrying a spare pair of shades to seeing those two clowns handle heavy explosives made for alot of much needed sincere entertainment.

Rude and Reno were the comic relief. Given that AC was a profoundly serious movie (minus their antics, of course), using two comical individuals as the main characters wouldn't have worked.

And, of course, there's the fact that AC is the sequel to FFVII. Not surprising that it would revolve around Cloud.

and Rufus went from Wily E Coyotee style corporate bumbling to having balls of sheer steel by the way he punked kadaj. Why couldnt those guys have been the main characters of the film? thats the REAL flaw. That writing and characters like that were relegated to second banana status.

Rufus was actually a very interesting character, as he unerwent genuine growth and development between FFVII and AC. That being said, he simply couldn't have carried the movie. Oh, and it was a sequel to FFVII.

there were alot of other issues I had, but I can stop now. Ive made enough of my point. As a video game Film, Advent Children is the cream of the crop. As a film period, it ranks beneath waterworld, and Gigli.

Given that you completely misunderstood just about everything that happened, you might want to consider watching the movie again, and rethinking your opinions. You probably won't change your mind, as I get the feeling that you're simply looking for reasons to dislike the movie, but it probably wouldn't hurt anyway.

[Ishin Ookami]

What I wrote here wasnt so much a review, but a rant. An opinion. There are so many people here who will tell you why AC is such a good film, I wanted to see what the reply would be when I stated what I found wrong with the film. I like to think I dont have a terribly high standard for movies, as Im someone who was actually entertained by Phantom Menace despite the gunguns, Anakin and his "Yahooing" the film straight to the Razzies, and exploits of obi whine kenobi. Yet I consider advent children to be slightly better. my review for AC is on the reader review section of the gameinformer boards if anyone would like to see. This, was just my stating my opinions about the majority of AC's flaws.

Also, I really didnt mention. Some have stated in rebutting my original post that seph did more then prance, rant and die, that he had a "awesome" fight scene. I wouldnt call his and clouds fight awesome, more like a musical number. In anime and hong kong fight scenes, most of the time the directors are experienced enough to be able to tell a story and give you character info with the fights. A fight scene is more then fancy hopping, bopping, and kicking really high. Its using technique to overcome your opponents technique, and vice versa. Who has the better skills, who will tire out first, which opponent will make a fatal error and thus loose, these are the questions that make a good fight scene so dramatic. I consider Nomura to be a hack for many reasons, but the majority of the action scenes in Advent Children make my point for me. Very few, if any of the outcomes of the fight scenes in AC are determined by skill, technique, or stamina, its all a montage of flying, slashing, shooting, and dodging until someone gets licked the hardest. The fight scenes have the feel of wuxia and anime merged, but not the substance. In wuxia yes there is flying, there is chi blasts and the use of chi to poison, incapacitate, freeze, heal, ect. There is superhuman feats that beg the suspension of disbelief, but it all flows on a sense of logic and rules. Ditto for the majority of anime as well. But most of the fight scenes in AC just dont follow any logic as well. Prior to Clouds little pep rally with vincent he was getting his butt handed to him by the seph clones. Afterwrds he's kicking ass and taking names for no apparent reason. It would have been cool to see the seph trio use various techniques on him that succeeded prior, then see cloud countering those techniques. And sephs end was very anticlimatic, I mean c'mon a limit break? HUH? Is it too much to ask that there be SOME logic or flow to this movie or was it all used up for rufus, the turks, vincent and yuffie?

[Karl]

there is no acceptable ending to anything that would suprise anyone, therefor a limit break is well suited, and its not like that was the only limit break in the entire movie

[Christmas]

Does that mean when Cloud uses omni slash he shouts "Omni slash" and Sephiroth shout "anti omni-slash" and counter the move. Then Cloud uses "anti-anti omni slash" and vice versa until someone with the most "anti" win since this show his technique overcome the others.

So bascially, one will use his technique and the other will wait there and observe how to counter his technique? This is a prove of skill?

Anyway, Loz did uses some special technique in the movie and Cloud uses blade beam to counter it.

So must Loz keep hitting the ground or uses some other fancy techniques and Cloud just keep using limit break to counter it until one give up?

Also, a limit break is a technique that you are talking about

Let's just say in a real fight, will you wait for your opponent to use his special kung fu technique and you counter it with one of yours special kung fu technique too. Then you wait for him to uses his other techniques or vice versa.
.

If you want some logic like how Cloud can uses Omni Slash and we can't, well, this movie is called "Final Fantasy VII Advent Children" done by people using creativity.

[RiTaPuffy]

Nothing wrong with a review from a different angle on the film

Reviewing a movie is nothing about personal, you don't tell people how you think about the movie when you are reviewing it.

What he is doing is like:
"Omfg I hate Inuyasha because the characters basically look like the same, omfg the guy Inuyasha can hold a sword that big its not possible, omfg human can't use a bombarang that big, omfg the story sucks because I dont know whats going on".... and so on.

[krissy]

next time, read further.

i give legally blonde props
don't mean i'll see legally blonde 2 on my own accord

[ff7+ff10 gurl 100]

stopped reading there
what's the point of watching this movie if you didn't like the game very much

Me too

[Russ80]

Everyone except Masamune 1600 sounds like whining fan!!!!s. All you say is "why can't this be a good thing to have in a movie!" when you are "responding" to his rant. Thank you masamune for your intelligent reply. I have never played FF7 and AC did seem kinda random to me. I didn't like how everybody sucked vs. the bad guys in the beginning then suddenly they started owning them and jumping a million feet in the air. Maybe it's in the game, but throwing people 1000 ft into the air seemed to have no basis in anything that happened before. It didn't make sense to me.

Tifa didn't really seem to get owned by Loz until he cheated and did that little teleport trick.

All in all it had pretty good graphics, I liked those, and some decent fight scenes. If they had made it longer by adding some real story instead of a long string of fights I would call it a real movie. Obviously this would be hard because the whole premise of AC was rooted in FF7. For fanboys I guess this isn't a problem, but if you haven't beaten the game before, it will all seem a little too contrived.

[Winter Nights]

Reviewing a movie is nothing about personal, you don't tell people how you think about the movie when you are reviewing it.

That made no sense whatsoever. That's what a review is.. Your opinion of the movie.

In anycase.. I liked the movie, but I have to agree with a few of his points.

[Russielloyd]

Right...

I agree with everything "Masamune 1600" said(yes i did read all of it).

Everything that "Ishin Ookami" said is based on his misinterpretation( or i believe to be his assumption) of the story of FF7 and AC. All the storys in FF games have made sense as to what it in-tail in its plot if you dont understand it the first time, then you missed out on something that why you see the hundreds of threads asking about certain parts of FF7. Clearly "Masamune 1600" and most of the people on this site knows the whole story and plot to F77 and thats why your the only one bashing story elements that makes sense to everyone else.

You want a tip Ishin Ookami?

Before you make a long massive complaint about any game/movie/book, make sure you know the actual story etc and not thoughts based on your snap reaction assumptions.

I sugest you play FF7, read the two Novellas' and watch AC again and take in mind what every thing that "Masamune 1600" has told you, then come back to us with a proper review.

[Winter Nights]

First off, any piece of media that requires you to watch/read/play another media just to know what is going on is automatically at fault for people not getting it. 90% of all sequels are standalone. You rarely will have had to watch the other movies. Some do and some pull it off well regardless, just by being great movies. Regardless of knowing what the backstory is, you can enjoy the movie because it gives you the details of what you need to know. AC is not that movie. Which makes everything he said valid, because the makers of the movie were to dense to gather that not everyone will want to read novellas or play every aspect of the game to "get it". The intro that tells the backs story tells alot of details of the plot of FF7, but gives you no info that is relevant to the plot of the movie.. Aside from Sephy was bad, someone died, and the planet saved us but cursed us. Any movie that has to use other products, movies or otherwise, as a crutch is just a product of bad film-making. Hell, most of the "cameos" remained nameless until the credits.

So yes, in the context of the game and the novellas and whatever other products SE considers canon, it may a decent flick with some awesome fight scenes. But, as a standalone flick, which nothing makes FF7:AC special, it would be reviewed as one, it's just plain [img]/xxx.gif[/img][img]/xxx.gif[/img][img]/xxx.gif[/img][img]/xxx.gif[/img]ty filmwork with some pretty packaging. No media product should require you understand or even enjoy another product, to enjoy it.

As I said, I liked it. It was a pretty little reminder of a decent game that came out years ago. It had alot of eye-candy and was not a waste of 90 minutes. But that's it. If you love it, great. But don't beat the guy down for not treating it like the piece of brilliance you think it is.

[RiTaPuffy]

That made no sense whatsoever. That's what a review is.. Your opinion of the movie.

In anycase.. I liked the movie, but I have to agree with most of his points.

Then you have no idea how to review a movie, you are a bad reviewer thats all, period.

[Winter Nights]

Then you have no idea how to review a movie, you are a bad reviewer thats all, period.

Oh please then, wise one. Enlighten me on how a review isn't what one thinks of a film. :rolleyes2

[Russielloyd]

Any movie that has to use other products, movies or otherwise, as a crutch is just a product of bad film-making

You cant say that it was bad film making, yes new people watching will proberly say "what the hell was that all about", but If their serious about wanting know the full story, then they'll play all aspects of the story FF7 story, then watch AC again and they'll understand. AC was made and based on the fact that you have already played FF7. The movie was never intended to bring new comers, but to satisfy the people who love FF7.

[Winter Nights]

You cant say that it was bad film making, yes new people watching will proberly say "what the hell was that all about", but If their serious about wanting know the full story, then they'll play all aspects of the story FF7 story. AC was made and based on the fact that you have already played FF7. The movie was never intended to bring new comers, but to satisfy the people who love FF7.

But, you can't pretend that, as a movie, that it isn't a fault. When someone reviews a movie, they will be reviewing the movie, not every piece of work created about or before the movie. Movies are always going to be reviewed as stand-alone film, and as such will be found at fault for NOT being stand-alone.