Revelation of Time Compression

[Viator]

The assumption that time is infinite is purely baseless (whoever disagrees can by all means try and explain Viator's argument here); in fact, we should rather assume the opposite, because if time were infinite, TC would never be possible. Why? Because TC works at a finite speed, and would thus never be able to finish compressing everything. Thus the whole "TC is really time absorbing" argument goes out the window, which is good, because it didn't make any sense to begin with. TC compresses time, but Ultimecia also happens to transform into her "True Ultimecia" form which allows her to also absorb everything being compressed (as well as space), hence the scan info.

I think saying time is infinite is logic and make sense.
Why dont you explain it yourself Bahamut.
TC still possible even time is infinite.(The Process of TC is The achievement of TC).TC works at finite speed to absorb Time,so this "finite speed" will go on forever and never stop because time is infinite.Now I want to ask you how can you absorb something infinite?

[QUOTE]Now, the reason Squall and Co can fight Ultimecia is because time is not yet fully compressed. If it were, they would be unable to exist (only Ultimecia can exist in TC). The reason why Squall and Co can fight Ultimecia inTC because TC only absorb time and space NOT human.I already explain how Squall and Co can get inside TC.

Why Squall and Co can go through TC to the future inside Lunatic Pandora and why we see the effect of TC in Lunatic Pandora?
The answer is because Ultimecia cast TC and because of Ellones power.
No 2 is the most important part because that is the event Squall and Co go to the future.
Then why ONLY in Lunatic Pandora;Squall and Co can go through TC and go to the future?
It's because the 'effect' of Ellone sends Rinoa back to the present IN Lunatic Pandora will make only Squall and Co can go through TC when they inside Lunatic Pandora,while everyone else CANT.Because Lunatic Pandora is the place Ellone use her power and her power affected with TC then make ONLY Squall and Co can go to the future(The source of Ellones power at that time is inside Lunatic Pandora)That's why ONLY Lunatic Pandora is the ONLY way Squall and Co can go inside TC.That's why we can see the effect of TC.
You see when Rinoa is back to present in Lunatic Pandora Squall and Co get to Time Compression.
Why Laguna and Ellone dont get to TC too?
It is because they already out from that room
(The room when we fight Adel)
So that room is the connection to get inside TC.
Because Laguna and Ellone already out of that room they dont get inside TC,that's why ONLY Squall and Co alone can get inside TC and nobody else

Rinoa said only Ultimecia can exist in TC because only Ultimecia inside TC and nobody else.But than there's something going on,because Squall and Co can get inside TC that means whorvre can get inside TC can exist.

They are however able to avoid being absorbed by Ultimecia by using sheer willpower and having belief in eachother, like Laguna says in the Ragnarok on beforehand ("It's all about friendship, love and courage etc.").

This friendship,etc only neccesary when they get inside TC and out of
TC.They dont get absorbed inside TC because

So they can survive inside TC because they are not part of Time and Space.Actually Time Compression ONLY absorb Time and Space.
Actually Human is NOT part of Time and Space.
They just exist in Time and Space.
So when Time Compression starts it only absorb Time and Space not human,Squall and Co is an EXCEPTION(I already explain why Squall and Co can exist in TC).

Now, fully compressed time would be like splitting up the line of time into a finite/infinite (we don't know if time is infinitely divisible in FF8 or not) amount of singular 'events', and then merging all those 'events' into one single event. That'd be TC.

Fully compressed time is not logic because Time is infinite.

However, the actual process of getting there, as well as the oddities regarding it's effects (eg. why we see the effects in the Lunatic Pandora and nowhere before that, when the spell was cast before the game starts) seem to be impossible to explain satisfactorily.

I already explain it very well why we see the effects in the Lunatic Pandora and nowhere before that, when the spell was cast before the game starts)

Why Squall and Co can go through TC to the future inside Lunatic Pandora and why we see the effect of TC in Lunatic Pandora?
The answer is because Ultimecia cast TC and because of Ellones power.
No 2 is the most important part because that is the event Squall and Co go to the future.
Then why ONLY in Lunatic Pandora;Squall and Co can go through TC and go to the future?
It's because the 'effect' of Ellone sends Rinoa back to the present IN Lunatic Pandora will make only Squall and Co can go through TC when they inside Lunatic Pandora,while everyone else CANT.Because Lunatic Pandora is the place Ellone use her power and her power affected with TC then make ONLY Squall and Co can go to the future(The source of Ellones power at that time is inside Lunatic Pandora)That's why ONLY Lunatic Pandora is the ONLY way Squall and Co can go inside TC.That's why we can see the effect of TC.
You see when Rinoa is back to present in Lunatic Pandora Squall and Co get to Time Compression.
Why Laguna and Ellone dont get to TC too?
It is because they already out from that room
(The room when we fight Adel)
So that room is the connection to get inside TC.
Because Laguna and Ellone already out of that room they dont get inside TC,that's why ONLY Squall and Co alone can get inside TC and nobody else

For more on time and TC in FF8, refer to the "Time/Ultimecia Plot FAQ" found here:

http://www.gamefaqs.com/console/psx/game/197343.html

which Viator tries to negate in the beginning of this topic. Unfortunately, he doesn't make enough sense to require any arguments.

Come on Bahamut,you admit it yourself that your FAQ has one big mistake.I already pointed out your mistakes(well it only the matter of perspective).You tried to explain about TC in simple way but your explanation always end up with question which can destroy you explanation.I already ash you the question regarding your explanation about TC but you dont answer it,why because you can find the answer and because you cant find the answer that means your explanation is wrong

[Sir Bahamut]

Definitely, the explanation of TC in the FAQ isn't perfect, like you say, but that's because the game isn't perfect. Your theories here however are wildly baseless and irrational.

Human beings aren't part of time and space, they only exist in it, hence they aren't compressed? Ellone powers somehow influence TC to make the effects only visible in the Lunatic Pandora? It is possible to absorb something infinite but not compress something infinite?

Sorry, but it's only painfully obvious that your explanations are quite illogical.

[Viator]

Definitely, the explanation of TC in the FAQ isn't perfect, like you say, but that's because the game isn't perfect. Your theories here however are wildly baseless and irrational.

Actually the game can perfect if you have HIGH IMAGINATION.
My theory can explain what happens in The process of TC,you just dont want to admit it.

Human beings aren't part of time and space, they only exist in it, hence they aren't compressed? Ellone powers somehow influence TC to make the effects only visible in the Lunatic Pandora? It is possible to absorb something infinite but not compress something infinite?

Exactly

Sorry, but it's only painfully obvious that your explanations are quite illogical.

My explanation is logic,it only the matter how you look at that explanation.

[Christmas]

Actually the game can perfect if you have HIGH IMAGINATION.

Indeed, you really need a lot of imagination to twist come out with stuff like this and actually understand it.

And ya, it is good that you base all this on your IMAGINATION.

My theory can explain what happens in The process of TC,you just dont want to admit it.

Mine can too, you just don't want to admit it too.

[Viator]

Indeed, you really need a lot of imagination to twist come out with stuff like this and actually understand it.

And ya, it is good that you base all this on your IMAGINATION.

I think every single theory or work all come up with imagination.
(If you know what I am talking about).

Mine can too, you just don't want to admit it too.

Show it to Me.

[hb2]

When i read/post in this thread i always have in mind that TC can be viewed form 2 points

And both points can't be proven

1)time is finite
2)time is infinite

Sir Bahamut, Squall of SeeD and TheOnionKnight did a great job on the FAQ, but you guys must admit, it's mostly based on the Assumption that time is finite (from what i've read). Viator on the other hand tries to explain and discuss it from the viewpoint that time is Infinite. (at least, i think so, if i'm wrong i'd better leave this topic )

Definitely, the explanation of TC in the FAQ isn't perfect, like you say, but that's because the game isn't perfect. Your theories here however are wildly baseless and irrational.

They are based mostly on the assumption that time is infinite, just as your faq is based on the assumption that time is finite.
So far i found it very enlighting reading this thread and also your faq, since they explain point of the time compression both in different ways, but they also both work in theory. (for as far as the game goes, i mean, not like in reallife)

[Viator]

Actually their explanation always come up with question that will always destroy their explanation.

[hb2]

can you prove that? sorry but that is a statement you post because you are somehow mad at those authors because they dont support your theory. at that's what i think.

Discussing this subject remains fun though :P

[Viator]

Actually I already ask that question in post no 1 but I delete it because it only make things look complicated.Bahamut dont even tries to answer that questions he just ignore it.

[hb2]

You havent answered my question, to prove that "Actually their explanation always come up with question that will always destroy their explanation."

i understand you can become frustated because of people arguing so much, but this is probably one of the things that makes Sir B. ignore you.

[Viator]

So here is the mistakes:
Red is Me
-----------------------------------
SORCERESS POWERS + THE TIMELOOP
-----------------------------------


Scanning Ultimecia in the final battle reveals that she intends to become
all-powerful by taking all the sorceress powers through time. This directly
implies a basic fact about sorceress powers, namely that they are additive.
Sorceress power A + Sorceress Power B = Sorceress Power AB, which is a
greater power than A or B by themselves. The reason this is relevant to the
discussion, is that the main part of the loop involves a power transfer. To
visualise this, we will make a simple diagram tracing who gets what powers
in the game. If you wonder who the "unknown sorceress" is, you must remember
that Edea is a sorceress before Ultimecia gives her her powers, but since we
are never told anything about this sorceress, we label her thus.


|----------------------------------|
| |
Unknown sorceress--->Edea--->Rinoa--->Unknown Era--->Ultimecia


---
NOTE: As you can see, I have not included Adel giving powers to Rinoa here.
The reason is that Adels powers are not an essential part of the loop,
meaning it would merely complicate the diagram.
---

As you can see, since sorceress powers are additive, it would seem that the
powers of each sorceress from Edea to Ultimecia increases for each span of
the loop! The dynamic time theory allows this to happen, but the static time
theory does not. Does this mean that the static time theory is ultimately
wrong? The answer is no. This is no more a flaw than the term "SeeD" having
no meaningful origin. To see this, we'll look closer into the powers being
transferred.

Edeas initial powers = A
Adels powers = B
Ultimecias powers(which include A and B) = C

But since we see that Edea gets Ultimecias powers, we could say that

A = A + C.

Such a 'formula' for Edeas powers works in the dynamic time theory,
because that would simply express the fact that Edeas powers increase for
each loop. It would of course for this reason be more accurate to write that:

A-->A + C-->(A + C) + C--> etc.

In other words that A BECOMES A + C, not that it IS A + C. But what about
the static time theory? Powers are forbidden from adding up within the loop
because that would mean that you can change the past. How do we then account
for this seeming paradox? Well, remember the analogy of rewinding the video
I used earlier? It applies here too: the events in which the powers transfer
happens once, and only once. This means that thinking of the loop as
transpiring more than once is as silly as thinking of the events in a video
as happening more than once depending on how many times you look at it!
We fall into this paradox because we are literally letting our eyes trace
around the loop more than once, which creates the illusion that powers must
increase each time we come full circle, but as explained above, this is quite
flawed and incorrect. The fact is that within the static time theory, any
event happens once and only once, which means the power transfers happen
once, and only once, meaning asking if the powers 'add up' for each loop is
a meaningless question.

That Explanation is wrong and I will make it right.
Edeas initial powers = A
Adels powers = B and then after that Rinoa recieved Adels powers.
Rinoas powers = B
Ultimecias powers = (C) ; Her power is He life

Edeas powers after Ultimecia possess her = A + (C) = A(C).
Ultimecias and Edeas powersdo not added up because you can see there's "( )" ;boundary between their powers.So Ultimecia only use her own powers / (C)

So it doesnt matter if you look at it as static or dynamic time.

I already PROVE that Rinoa only has Adels powers NOT Edeas.If you cant accept this truth you wont find the answer.You will only stuck in your wrong perspective.(just read Rev of the Truth thread)

Second mistake :
If you view the ULOT from the outside, and picture it as being a film
consisting of slides, you'd find one slide which we could apptly label the
'TC-slide'. This slide would, if TC were fully completed, contain the entire
ULOT. But it is not that the TC event creates a seperate ULOT; it doesn't
form duplicates of all the events on the ULOT. To understand what Onion has
proposed, think of one of those odd 'picture in a picture' pictures. For
example, imagine you have a picture of a man watching television, from such
an angle that you can see what he is watching. Then imagine that the image
you see on the television screen is the exact same picture as the 'original'
picture. In theory, this picture would extend for ever inside the picture,
because each 'layer' would have another television in it. Onions idea is that
TC acts in the same way; the TC event would be like the television of the
above example. But remember, as I said before, TC creates no duplicates!
Instead, the ULOT we see inside the TC event IS the ULOT which the TC event
is situated on. What this means, is that once the TC event contains more and
more events, those same events on the ULOT will essentially be compressed.
In a fully compressed time, the TC event would thus be seen to contain the
entire ULOT, so the entire ULOT would be compressed. The idea is then that
Ultimecia could shape the events within the TC event as she finds suiting,
and in doing so shapes the ULOT which the TC event is on. To make a diagram
of the TC event on the ULOT:


<---------------A--TC-B-----C


A is the event in which Squall defeats Adel.
TC is, you guessed it, the TC event.
B is Squalls return from the future.
C is the Garden party in the ending.

This astounding idea seems overly complicated at first, and it took me(Sir
Bahamut) quite a while to fully appreciate it, but it works incredibly well.
TC would merely be another fated event on the ULOT, just as set in stone as
the rest. Furthermore, the events contained in the TC event would be a
'fated' set of events, which would not actually be ALL of the events. This
rids us of the problem of TC lasting for a finite amount of time while
keeping up with the basic ideas of TC. But it was realised that there was one
problem in any view of TC which caused all sorts of debates. The problem is
this:

We have already established that TC is cast in the past, and that it works
at a finite speed. But why do we only see the effects of TC after Adels
defeat? To make an image which should make the question clear:

Why Squall and Co can go through TC to the future inside Lunatic Pandora and why we see the effect of TC in Lunatic Pandora?
The answer is because Ultimecia cast TC and because of Ellones power.
No 2 is the most important part because that is the event Squall and Co go to the future.
Then why ONLY in Lunatic Pandora;Squall and Co can go through TC and go to the future?
It's because the 'effect' of Ellone sends Rinoa back to the present IN Lunatic Pandora will make only Squall and Co can go through TC when they inside Lunatic Pandora,while everyone else CANT.Because Lunatic Pandora is the place Ellone use her power and her power affected with TC then make ONLY Squall and Co can go to the future(The source of Ellones power at that time is inside Lunatic Pandora)That's why ONLY Lunatic Pandora is the ONLY way Squall and Co can go inside TC.That's why we can see the effect of TC.
You see when Rinoa is back to present in Lunatic Pandora Squall and Co get to Time Compression.
Why Laguna and Ellone dont get to TC too?
It is because they already out from that room
(The room when we fight Adel)
So that room is the connection to get inside TC.
Because Laguna and Ellone already out of that room they dont get inside TC,that's why ONLY Squall and Co alone can get inside TC and nobody else


Past<---------------A----------------B----------------->Future


A is the event in which Ultimecia casts the spell.
B is the event in which Adel is defeated.

Now, TC would by all logic have to affect the events inbetween A and B
before affecting B, since it works at a finite speed, and is cast in a point
before B. This is all nice until we realise with startling realisation that
the events between A and B include, among other things, the events we play
in the game! We see that TC is cast long before event B, yet for some
mysterious reason we see no effects anywhere before event B, when common
sense would dictate that the events inbetween should experience the same
kind of "Hippie weirdness"(a joke term by Onion which caught on) that we see
after Adel is defeated(ie. the room melting away, big bubbles of memories
floating around, falling up into the sea etc.). But for some odd reason, we
don't! Why not?

Several attempts were made to explain this, ranging from the idea that
Ultimecia casts TC in more than one point in time to new elaborate theories
on TC, but no good explanation could be found. As it turned out, the answer
eluded explanation because of the image of the ULOT. We had already realised
that the ULOT was an incomplete picture, but despite knowing this, we were
all too set in the old ways. The answer, which now seems ridiculously
obvious, did however come to me in the end, but only after a long day of
completely re-evaluating the static time theory...


Actually We cant see the effect of TC,the reason why we can see the effect of TC after Adels defeat because of Ellone's power.
just read the explanation no 5
Third mistake :

Firstly, there is the fact that Squall and Co never actually seem to try and
affect Laguna and Co in any way. Surely, as Ultimecia has shown us, such
manipulation of people using Ellones magic is very possible, but while
Ultimecia uses this left and right, Squall and Co never do anything other
than seemingly give them added power in battle(remember the 'fairies' Laguna
and Co speak of, and how they imply battles are a walk in the park when
they're around).

That explaination is wrong Ultimecia never do such manipulation thing because Her life is Her power.Just read Rev of the Truth thread

forth mistake :

Squall then makes another attempt at getting back, but yet again fails, and
gets stuck in some sort of timewarp; a mixture of various times, ssemingly
reacting to his own thought, emotions and memories. As said above, he ends
up alone in a barren wasteland because he is still stuck in his 'lone wolf'
attitude. As he tries to simply walk his way out of this place, he realises
eventually that he's not getting anywhere, and that he's stuck. Affected by
these thoughts, the time warp now alters, and when Squall turns around, he
finds that he is literally stuck on a tiny island in the middle of nowhere.
Collapsing, he starts thinking about Rinoa, and yet again, the time-warp he's
in reacts to that, but since his emotions are full of despair and
hopelessness, what he sees is inevtiably tainted by just that. Because of
this, he sees his memories all twisted, and even sees things which haven't
happened(like Rinoas helmet shattering in space). Finally, he collapses from
the strain. There is some dispute whether or not Squall dies here or not, but
either way, what happens next is the same: Rinoa, through her love for
Squall, is able to make her way to him and save him(remember that emotions
were the key in this situation). As they embrace, they both break free from
the time warp, and can proceed to the Garden, where a big party awaits.

your explanation is nonsense and wrong.If Squall still dont leave his aloof attitude how can he made it through TC to the future with everybody else.
The reason why he all alone is ... you dont need to know.

fifth mistake :
But what about the problem of the "hippie weirdness"? The solution lies in
the idea of the PLOTs having the same boundaries and existing side by side
as in the diagram above. If we consider Ultimecias PLOT and Squalls PLOT as
unfolding next to eachother, we realise what is clearly shown to us in the
game: the event on Ultimecias PLOT in which she casts TC is adjacent to the
event on Squalls PLOT in which he has just defeated Adel! To make a picture:

Ultimecias PLOT: Birth---------------A------------------>
Squalls PLOT: Birth---------------B------------------>

A is the event in which Ultimecia casts TC.
B is the event where Squall has just defeated Adel.

The event A, though far in the past as seen from Squalls PLOT, is adjacent to
the event B on the PLOT-sheet! Bringing in TheOnionKnight's theory on TC, we
have that the TC event is established on every PLOT-event adjacent to event
A. That's why we only see "hippie weirdness" after Adels defeat and nowhere
else. In the words of TheOnionKnight, "TC happens where it happens because
that's where it happens!"

You make Ultimecias PLOT adjacent with Squalls PLOT
to make conclusion why we see effect of TC after Adels defeat.Using 'adjacent' thing cant/wont explain that question.Then why you dont explain the effect of TC in Final Battle.So this explaination is wrong.

Why Squall and Co can go through TC to the future inside Lunatic Pandora and why we see the effect of TC in Lunatic Pandora.
The answer is because Ultimecia cast TC and because of Ellones power.
I will make a diagram to make you understand.

I will make a diagram to make you understand.

7--------------------8-----------------------9-------10----------11
|**********************************|\*** ***********/
|**********************************|*\** **********/
|**********************************|**\* *********/
|6*********************************|***\ 13******/ 14
|\*********************************|**** \******/
|*\********************************|**** *\****/
|**\*******************************|**** **\**/
|***\2*****************************|**** ***\/
|****\*****************************|**** ** / 15
|*****\****************************|**** /
|******\ **************************|***/
5*******>1------------12-----------------| /
|******/
|*****/
|****/ 3
|***/
|**/
|*/
|/
4
* = NOTHING (I just put them to make the diagram perfect).
So actually there’s NO “*” in that diagram)
1 = Rinoa (PRESENT)
2 = The way Squall and Co go through TC
3 = The way Rinoa back to the present
4 = Young Adel (past)
5 = The way Ultimecia back to the future
6 = The commencement Room
7 = Ultimecia’s Castle (Future)
8 = Time Compression
9 = Time Decompression
10 = The way Squall go to the past (Ending Event)
11 = The Ending Event (You know what I am talking about)
12 = The way Quistis,Selphie,Irvine,Zell back to present from Time Decompression
13 = The way Rinoa end up in garden BUT still in Time Decompression
14 = Squall all alone in Time Decompression World
15 = Rinoa found Squall and after that back to the present

7 - 8 = Time after Phase 1 and before Phase 2
2,4,5,6,7 = Phase 1
8-9 = Phase 2

Time between 7 and 8 not affected by TC because Phase 1 is over and phase 2 is not happen yet.


No 2 is the most important part because that is the event Squall and Co go to the future.
Then why ONLY in Lunatic Pandora;Squall and Co can go through TC and go to the future?
It's because the 'effect' of Ellone sends Rinoa back to the present IN Lunatic Pandora will make only Squall and Co can go through TC when they inside Lunatic Pandora,while everyone else CANT.Because Lunatic Pandora is the place Ellone use her power and her power affected with TC then make ONLY Squall and Co can go to the future(The source of Ellones power at that time is inside Lunatic Pandora)That's why ONLY Lunatic Pandora is the ONLY way Squall and Co can go inside TC.That's why we can see the effect of TC.

This (My) theory explains everyhing about what happened in Lunatic Pandora.I hope you peruse this theory until you understand.

Now I realized there’s somethig more about TC.Actually there’s 2 phases of TC.
The first phase is when Squall and Co go through TC and end up in Ultimecia’s Castle in future.At this phase 1 we see the effect of TC,but after Squall and Co arrived at Ultimecia’s Castle in future we don’t see any effect of TC again,why?It because The phase 2 is not happen yet.What I mean is this phase 2 needs TIME to happens,that’s why we don’t see any effect of TC when Squall and Co arrived at Ultimecia’s Castle.Ultimecia uses this phase 1 to get back to the future to possess Her own body(If you read Rev of the Truth thread,you must know what I am talking about).
So TIME between after the Phase 1 and before the Phase 2 is the time Squall and Co kill all Ultimecia’s servant.When Squall encounter Ultimecia,She said the world was
on the brink of that ever-elusive 'time compression'.That means the phase 2 is almost begin.The phase 2 begin when we fight Ultimecia at that Final Battle. That’s why we see the effect of TC.

Now I already fully explain why we see the effect of TC in Lunatic and in the Final Battle.I realized this when I remember Squall said I don't know what's going on. But since we're still here, I think we still have “some time” to finish our job.


The Process of Time Compression = The Achievement of TC. This is the Truth.

I want to add something about Lunatic Pandora.
You see when Rinoa is back to present in Lunatic Pandora Squall and Co get to Time Compression.
Why Laguna and Ellone dont get to TC too?
It is because they already out from that room
(The room when we fight Adel)
So that room is the connection to get inside TC.
Because Laguna and Ellone already out of that room they dont get inside TC,that's why ONLY Squall and Co alone can get inside TC and nobody else.





There's the mistakes I find so far
You see that is very long.I dont want to read it again this time.I will add another question next time.
If you dont understand just ask that one by one

i understand you can become frustated because of people arguing so much, but this is probably one of the things that makes Sir B. ignore you.

He ignore Me because he cant answer My questions.

[Sir Bahamut]

Sir Bahamut, Squall of SeeD and TheOnionKnight did a great job on the FAQ, but you guys must admit, it's mostly based on the Assumption that time is finite (from what i've read). Viator on the other hand tries to explain and discuss it from the viewpoint that time is Infinite. (at least, i think so, if i'm wrong i'd better leave this topic )

That's all well and good, except his theories rely on the baseless assumption that time compression is actually time absorbtion. Not only is this not suggested by the game, he hasn't actually made any arguments as to why it should be possible to absorb an infinite timeline but not compress it.

The rest of his theories are all based on bad foundations. He assumes Ellones powers have an influence on TC, ignoring the fact that the Ragnarok make it to the future even though they were never in the Lunatic Pandora. He assumes TC is made up of two phases, even though this is not either suggested by the game.

He's correct that our explanation of TC still has one central flaw, which we obviously acknowledge, but Viator's apparent 'solution' requires a load of baseless assumptions and strange logic which just aren't plausible. Just read the edited first post of this thread, and this quickly becomes apparent (just look at that diagram for crying out loud!). The sad truth is that Square didn't give us enough information to satisfactorily explain TC completely.

He ignore Me because he cant answer My questions.

Nah, it's got more to do with you making statements such as "The reason why he all alone is ... you dont need to know." etc as well as being generally making arguments which generally don't require any sort of rebuttal in order to make the flaws apparent.

[DK]

I think the real question here is why did Squall and Rinoa name their child Wallace Barret? HMM? HMM?

[Christmas]

Squall is impotent, he must have kidnapped that brat from somewhere.

[Sir Bahamut]

IT'S THE TRUUUUTH!