SE confirms: player excuse to diminish enjoyment of smn job adjusted

[Garland]

Effective after the October update, whenever a summoner says: "I don't want to be a main healer," the default reply shall be: "What do you plan to do for 30 seconds between BPs?". Note that the current default reply is: "What do you plan to do for one minute between BPs?".

Changes to the Summoner Job
Summoners use the Blood Pact pet command as their main way of doing battle. Both attacks and support/healing magic are included in this command and operate with a single recast time.

The development team has decided to split Blood Pact into two commands to allow players to select a strategy to fit the current situation once every minute.

[The New Blood Pacts]
The summoner pet command Blood Pact will be divided into two categories, each with its own recast time. "Blood Pact: Rage" will focus on direct damage and special attacks, while "Blood Pact: Ward" will center on support, enfeebling, and healing magic.

· Blood Pact: Rage (Recast time: 1 minute)
Orders the avatar to use special attacks.

· Blood Pact: Ward (Recast time: 1 minute)
Orders the avatar to use support abilities.

[Summoning Magic Skill]
- Effects on Blood Pact
Blood Pact will receive different effects when the value added by equipment or merit points exceeds the skill cap for that level.

For example, players can experience increased accuracy when using Blood Pact: Rage or lengthened effect durations when using Blood Pact: Ward. The length of the duration increased varies depending on which Blood Pact is used, but will not exceed 180 seconds.

A player whose summoning magic skill is lower than the skill cap will not experience any penalties, such as a decrease in accuracy or shortened effect durations.

- Skill Increases
The instances in which players can increase their skill will also be changed in accordance with the adjustments to summoning magic skill.

Originally, calling forth an avatar would sometimes improve a player's summoning magic skill. Soon players will also be able to experience increases in skill when using the Blood Pact: Rage and Blood Pact: Ward pet commands.

That wraps up the job-related changes coming in the next version update. More are scheduled for future updates, though, so keep checking the main page for the latest news!

[Miriel]

Uhhhh. No, man.

The CURRENT bloodpacts (all bloodpacts) can be done once every 60 seconds. With this adjusments, we'll be able to effectively cast 2 bloodpacts (one "ward' type BP and one "Rage" type bloodpact) within that one minute span.

What does that mean for Summoners? It'll mean that we'll be able to cast a buff like Earthen Ward, Hastega or a Party cure and immediately follow it with a damage attack like Double Punch or Meteorite since the timers for Ward type BPs will be seperate from Rage type BPs.

This is an AMAZING job update for Summoners.

The only concern for Summoners at this point will be learning how to conserve MP since if we take advantage of BPing twice every minute, we'll be using waaay more MP. Conservation will be key.

Honestly, this update makes me want to continue with Summoner rather than go with White Mage. I'm so excited about this update!

I don't really understand how your impressions about this adjustment went completely opposite of the reaction of most Summoners which was basically elation and excitement.

[Darius]

Sounds pretty sweet! I was considerig starting a summoner but now I think I will for sure.

[Bahamut2000X]

Well this could make the trial fights a bit more interesting. >.>

Now I can save my BP for both Astral Flow AND a heal from carby. <.<

Hmmm might have to give that a try then. Now to just get SMN out of the dunes. >.>

[Garland]

I don't really understand how your impressions about this adjustment went completely opposite of the reaction of most Summoners which was basically elation and excitement.

My response wasn't an impression of the update. I didn't comment in that regard. My post was the average party or FFXI community being forced to reword their excuse as to why summoners will still be pigeonholed into main healing. I think the update is going to be pretty cool, but I don't think it'll change community placement of the job in a party. If I end up wrong, that's great. I've always wanted summoners to exp as summoners.

[Yeargdribble]

I think the update is going to be pretty cool, but I don't think it'll change community placement of the job in a party. If I end up wrong, that's great.

I have to sadly agree with Garland. Once a job is pigeonholed, it is nigh impossible for them to get out of that role. I suppose there is a small chance that they might find a more normal spot in a PT.

Honestly, this puts SMN into a class of its own. They are now part BRD, part DD. With good conservation they could carry this role similar to COR (but with no Refresh), but I highly doubt PTs will allow for this. When someone wants a DD they aren't gonna invite SMN (just like they don't invite BLMs these days). Also, without refresh BRD and COR probably wouldn't even get invites. There are still a lot of ignorant melees that don't realize how much a BRD or COR enhances their performance. Without Refresh they would be out of a job and I think the case will be the same for SMN.

I hope I'm wrong, but having been with the community for sometime, I think I know their reaction. Unless it is new, amazing, and instantly noticable nothing will change. To non-SMNs this is essentially just shortening the time between them doing worthless BPs and wasting MP they should be using curing. /sad

[Bahamut2000X]

Hmm maybe now SMN will be able to actually have thier dispel be somewhat more useful then before. Although is Eclipse Bite (that's the BP for it right? >.>) considered a Rage or a Ward type ability? >.>

(just like they don't invite BLMs these days)

Whoa...wait...WHAT!? People not inviting BLM as a DD? I dunno how other servers are, but on my server BLM is the top DD required. And well, there's no reason for them NOT to be, as they are the strongest DD hands down in terms of direct pure out damage. If your trying to reference the nerf, you have to remember that was VS NM's only. And well, no exp party ever fights those to begin with, and on top of that it's only when you get the multiple BLM's vs a NM that you notice a change in damage.

But even so, unless SE drastically buffs the other DD or nerfs BLM for exp, then BLM will be the top DD. Although then again RNG is getting a buff soon. They might be fighting for the top of the DD chart again by popular views. >.>

[Yeargdribble]

(just like they don't invite BLMs these days)

Whoa...wait...WHAT!? People not inviting BLM as a DD? I dunno how other servers are, but on my server BLM is the top DD required. And well, there's no reason for them NOT to be, as they are the strongest DD hands down in terms of direct pure out damage. If your trying to reference the nerf, you have to remember that was VS NM's only. And well, no exp party ever fights those to begin with, and on top of that it's only when you get the multiple BLM's vs a NM that you notice a change in damage.

At what level? Pre 40 it's not so bad... almost any job gets decent invites. BLM invites at 60+ are almost non-existant. People prefer DDs that aren't limited by MP. Additionally, BLM can do a huge amount of damage but at a cost. If you do too much damage (which is easy) you pull hate. BLM can't take hits and if they pull too much hate they die. That means downtime. However, if a melee job takes hate, they are beefier and can take the hits.

People often don't want a job that is limited by their MP for damage (i.e. SMN or BLM). What made matters even worse is that post-RNG nerf everyone became a bandwagon BLM so they could be the biggest DD endgame again.

I think it's unfair, because a good BLM that knows how to MB can do great damage and as long as they toe the line of hate they are great assets.

[Miriel]

I don't really understand how your impressions about this adjustment went completely opposite of the reaction of most Summoners which was basically elation and excitement.

My response wasn't an impression of the update. I didn't comment in that regard. My post was the average party or FFXI community being forced to reword their excuse as to why summoners will still be pigeonholed into main healing. I think the update is going to be pretty cool, but I don't think it'll change community placement of the job in a party. If I end up wrong, that's great. I've always wanted summoners to exp as summoners.

The title you chose for this thread specifically implied that the job of Summoner was somehow diminished by this update, when in fact, the enjoyment people get from this job will probably go up a significant amount with these new adjustments.

What's a summoner gonna do during their time in between bloodpacts other than main heal? Well, I dunno. Maybe they could do what *I* usually end up doing in parties which is backup heal. With the new bloodpact timers, there's gonna be more opportunities to cast buffs, and cast damage attacks, have the avatars melee in between and the Summoner themself can throw out cures when needed.

Worthless bloodpacts? How many of the people on this forum consider BPs to be worthless? Because I've never partied with anyone who considered my bloodpacts worthless and I certainly don't believe that's the prevailing belief in the FFXI community. Buffs such as Earthen Ward and Hastega are very valuable to a party, and I would think most people realize that.

Do people rely on SMNs as main healers when there's a shortage of WHMs or RDMs? Sure! But that doesn't mean people won't allow for this or won't allow for that. Besides, if I don't want to main heal, I won't. Sometimes I don't mind main healing. Other times I'll just wait for a party that already has a healer or create a party of my own.

Is this update revolutionary for SMNs? Heck no. But it does allow us to do more. More buffs, more damage, just MORE for the job class. And that's just an all around great thing.

[Fuego]

I think its a good idea. My summoner is only at 25 but i am starting to get the buff BP's and during battle i can see how this system will help.

But as for main healing, i am used to that seeing as how when i started the game my main job is Rdm ... then lvl'd whm to sub ... LOL

I'm very interested to try it out

[Yeargdribble]

I think what this update will allow SMN to do and what the community will allow SMN to do are 2 totally different things. While this update might make SMN a reasonable DD/buffer with the ability to back-up heal... the community has gotten used to SMN as a healer and the community doesn't really accept buffing jobs that much. From most people's PoV a buffing job is just a waste of a DD spot. Now don't get me wrong, because I don't think this is the case honestly. As a BRD I fully understand what a buffing only job can do to a PT to make it much more efficient.

However, even with Ballad and all of the buffs BRD gets... my wife cannot get PTs on her BRD at 41. Why? Because people don't want a buffer... they want a Refresh whore. RDM and COR supercede BRD in that area at 41. So if even BRD with Ballad I can't get PTs to be a buffer, it's unlikely SMN will. Even with the DD attributes people will still invite SMN primarily as a main healer when there isn't a WHM.

As nice as things like Hastega are, they don't last long enough. Earthen Ward at least lasts a while. While you can increase the duration of your buffs now you would have to do so through insanely expensive gear. Summoning Earrings have been flying off the AHs of the servers and going up in price quickly.

[Miriel]

Woooow, your server must be weird, cause BRDs get snatched up like nothing on Pandemonium. It's like, you do a search, "oh yay, a brd is seeking!" you go to invite, and bam, they're already gone. BRDs and CORs are among my favorite classes to party with. Seriously, I was always under the impression that Bards get invites super quick.

And I don't like that word, "allow". No one is gonna "allow" me to do anything. If I don't want to main heal. I won't. If I want to buff/dd, I will. I'll start my own party and get a main healer so that I won't have to do that job. I don't mind backup healing at all, but if I wanted to play as a gimped WHM, I'd just level WHM. I've never been in a situation where someone said, "oh, SMN isn't gonna main heal? *drops the party*" And I don't think a situation like that will ever come up.

[Del Murder]

Yeah, BRDs never last more than 5 min looking on our server, even after level 41.

BLMs go pretty fast too (I'm up to level 47 so I don't know about 60+). One great plus for a BLM over another DD is of course the Warp II when the party is over. People who don't invite BLMs, their loss, because they can do massive damage. I guess they just aren't good enough tanks who can keep the hate. *flex*

[Bahamut2000X]

Eh I guess it's just a difference of servers then. My server buffers are in high demand, and only really ever wait if there is a lack of a party forming/in need of a buffing slot. Pretty much everyone on Cait Sith realizes just how well thier ACC/ATK go up with a BRD/COR in the party.

As for the BLM bit, eh really pre-40's with refreash, thier downtime isn't a big deal as it's always the healers downtime you have to wait on anyways. Never once have we waited on the BLM's MP to be good.

And also thier in high demand in my server in exp parties, especially in the levels were you fight high def mobs like crabs or beetles, where BLM will excel over any other DD hands down.

But I guess it's just server difference really. I've heard other servers do some crazy stuff. Like Gilgamesh pre-RNG nerf I hear most everyone on the server refused to party with less then 2-3 RNG's and would wait to form the "perfect party" or not exp at all.

Now that's some craziness. Again I have only heard this though. >.>

[Markus. D]

wow, Summoner sounds rather interesting to myself, I might give it a try one day n_n-b If I could ever find the toleration to do the lengthy Job Quest ._.