Attempted English Lyrics for Latin song

[ZellDnicht]

<DIR>Okay folks, we've done it! We heard the song at least 40 times today and in 2 hours with our latin knowledge (6 years at school, 4 hours per week) and our big latin school bo + dictionary we transcripted the whole song, also the part with the shootings...
..And yes there were many mistakes in the old version. The meaning is completely different. You must know that in Latin one word like for example Dies, Diei has a different meaning in the different conjugations. And that's the big problem when you translate Latin. Your English translation is nice, but far from the right one...
</DIR>...Now we're going to translate it with our Latin professor because some grammatical constructions are probably of modern latin, and in the next days we'll post the new Subtitled Video on YouTube, and the correct translation on these pages. Ciao!

A little bit of the correct transcription, control yourself it's right:

Tellus dormit
et liberi in diem
faciunt numquam extingunt (yes it's hard to hear but she says extin..gunt test it with the volume at 100%)
ne expergisci (deponens infinitive) possint.

Not more, 'till the next days =))

ciao dall'italia!

[ZellDnicht]

Okay we worked with our latin professor and he heard the song with us. First of all we have to say that this girl Yoko Shimowhatever doesn't now latin at all, she uses grammatical constructions that are nonsense, incomplete sentences and wrong endings, but with some corrections we could translate it as close as possible. NOTE THAT THIS WAS TRANSLATED BY LATIN EXPERTS! BY A PROFESSOR! IT'S THE ONLY CORRECT VERSION WITH THESE WORDS! and at least, all words exist in latin! =) Note that the title of the song SOMNUS NEMURI is wrong it should be SOMNUS NEMORIS.
And here you have it:

LATIN
Tellus dormit
et liberi in diem faciunt
numquam extinguunt
ne expergisci possint.

Omnia dividit
tragoedia coram
amandum quae.

Et nocte perpetua
ehem vel vera visione
par oram videbo te
mane tempu expergiscendi.

ENGLISH:

Somnus Nemoris (Dream of the Wood)

The kingdom sleeps
and children sacrify theirselves day by day
until they extinguish,
and they will never awake.

This tragedy destroys
in front of them
every beloved thing.

And in this neverending night
look there, the real vision
on the edge I will see you
and the next morning the time will awake.

[ZellDnicht]

HERE THE CORRECT SUBTITLED VIDEO ON YOUTUBE! ENJOY!

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=Q0u7xTHvv4Y

[Vivisteiner]

First of all, you should not triple post.

Your translation is a good attempt, although even though it was done by a whole bunch of you, and your teacher, I dont agree completely. A lot of your words are similar anyway.
This is what I think:

Tellus dormit -agree
et liberi in diem faciunt - its similar to mine.
numquam extinguunt - Its hard to hear. The meaning is still similar.
ne expergisci possint. - Its too hard to tell if its 'nec sper' or 'ne exper'

Omnia dividit - I think I hear a 'v'
tragoedia coram
amandum quae.

Et nocte perpetua - I agree!
ehem vel vera visione - I disagree. I dont hear 'visi' and I hear an 'l' sound
par oram videbo te - I completely disagree. Im sure my Latin is more accurate.
mane tempu expergiscendi. - Im not sure. I think I hear a 'g', but I cant hear an 'x'. Anyway, it can also mean 'arise', which I think is the better translations. And is similar to 'ascend'.


My conclusion, is that you cannot say this is the correct version. Both of our versions have weaknesses. If we work together though, we could acheive an even more accurate translation.

Also, are you sure you are listening to a loud enough version. Some parts you say, I cannot hear. Especially the 2nd part of your translation.

Listen to this youtube link. http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=TOC8wDxwmLE
It is louder, and makes it easier to hear words.

I may post back with a reviewed version of the translation, when I next have time.

If only that woman would sing more clearly. Some words are just too hard to tell apart.

[ZellDnicht]

As i said, it is the only possible way to translate it with THE WORDS THAT WE HEARD. I didn't say this is the official translation. With the words that we think to hear, this is the closest way to translate them.

[StormGust]

sorry Vivisteiner,but without grammar, you can't translate a thing.

if you want to practice hearing the right things, listen to a Read-Version of Vergils Aeneid ( which due to it being poetry is kind of hard to understand)


also Coram is "facing" or "in view of" ~~ ( which doesn'T make sense at all) it could also be Corruam (future 1st person of corruere)

which, with it being AmandumQUE will translate to "and i will Destroy the Loved One"

and as posted by me on youtube is could also be "nex per ti, si concit" ... ( Nex in German is pronounced the way it is in this song... )

edit:

the "et nocte ... tempu" is correct, though i would guess its expergefaciendi and not just expergiscendi (i can clearly hear a "tiendi")

edit2:

ok part after the "numquam extinguunt" isn't possible as a "sh/sch" doesn'T exist in latin ( unless she is pronouncing a "t" or a "s" or a "c" this way (and untill someone agrees on the later) i won't start to look up all the possibilities for the words used there

[ZellDnicht]

Good entry! I suppose that now the only thing is to wait for the lyrics.

[Vivisteiner]

Updated Translation

A kingdom sleeps and children make groans that are never ended. Nor can they hope. A man is divided, he faces tragedy and is sent away. *

And in the everlasting night, he dreams of his other troubles. To bear every fear is his punishment which he must endure throughout time, and from it arise.

Tellus dormit,
Et liberi ingem faciunt
Numquam extinguunt.
Nec spertisi possit.

Hom vir dividit
Tragoedia coram
Amandamque

Et nocte perpetua
Ehem vers den alii onem.
Pavor omnifere pona
Manes tempus
Expergiscendi

Do you agree?



* It could easily be the translation you suggested, but to me it doesn’t sound right, or fit in with the second half of my translation.
Also, 'dreams' is lit 'thinks of.'

Grammar wise, its pointless checking that it perfectly agrees, since the singing is too unclear and you cannot get correct endings. That is why the translation is so debatable.
__________________

[StormGust]

i only agree on the "Tellus dormit et liberi"
ingem/in diem could also be "indem" ( which, alongside the numquam would make sense)

[ZellDnicht]

ehmm...you never studied latin at school, did you?

endings are important in latin, one word has different meanings with different endings. a word like DAY in latin (dies, diei) with different endings can be: to the day, at the day, in the day, day by day, etc.
You cannot ignore endings.

Second thing:
You invent most of the words of your translation as I said, ingem, den, hom, vir is nonsense if you think that hom means man, or she would say two times MAN, spertisi, and so on.

Third thing:
In latin you cannot transform a verb into a substantive as you want.

Then here:

Tellus dormit, OK
Et liberi ingem faciunt INGEM DOESN't EXIST (ingemo, ingemere)
Numquam extinguunt.
Nec spertisi possit. SPERTISI DOESN't EXIST , nec sperare possunt would be right.

Hom vir dividit Hom = nothing Vir = man (MAN/MAN?)
Tragoedia coram coram is not HE FACE! that's not a verb!
Amandamque (where can you find SENT AWAY? please tell me =))

Et nocte perpetua OK
Ehem vers den alii onem. den DOESN't EXIST, you don't have to dream in this sentence.
Pavor omnifere pona (poena)
Manes tempus manes is soul in latin
Expergiscendi

etc.etc.etc.

[Vivisteiner]

ehmm...you never studied latin at school, did you?

Please. Shut up.


Ok.
den = de.
Was a typo

Hom vir dividit Hom = nothing Vir = man (MAN/MAN?)
Tragoedia coram coram is not HE FACE! that's not a verb!
Amandamque (where can you find SENT AWAY? please tell me =))

The 'hom' bit, I wasnt really sure of. Its just because 'omnia' would not be pronounced in that way. I think I hear 'vir'.
'coram', I translated it liberally, to help it make sense. It could be 'A man is divided in the presence of tragedy, and is sent away.' I dont have time to cheack the grammar.

Amandamque - Could come from 'amando' which is send away. The grammar may not work out, but it doesnt work out for your version of the translation either. Youve used language liberally too.

Et nocte perpetua OK
Ehem vers den alii onem. den DOESN't EXIST, you don't have to dream in this sentence.
Pavor omnifere pona (poena)
Manes tempus manes is soul in latin
Expergiscendi

You have not criticised 'Pavor omnifere poena', which you did not have in your translation. I put 'dream' instead of 'thinks of'. Maneo = endure.
It could be 'His soul is punished to bear every fear throughout time, and from it arise.' Or something.

endings are important in latin, one word has different meanings with different endings. a word like DAY in latin (dies, diei) with different endings can be: to the day, at the day, in the day, day by day, etc.
You cannot ignore endings.

It is too hard to hear the ending. Therefore, I have focused upon meaning above grammar. Unless there is a massive mistake, theres probably no point debating about it.


Overall. I think your 1st verse could be better than mine (although I wont bother to change it) - and they have similar meanings.
Neither of our 2nd verses are particularly satisfactory. Im sure you know the faults and problems encountered in both.
And my 3rd verse is more accurate than yours.


Anyway, Im getting sick of this, so why dont we just laissez-faire.


EDIT: Actually, 'in diem' could be right. I wasnt satisfied by 'sacrifice' but it could be

'And the exploitation of children is never ended.'

[StormGust]

Omnia is pronounced that way, at least here in Germany :P

1. "pavor omnifere pona"

Pavor = dread
Omnifere= doesn't exist
pona= doesn't exist

so you should really start to think of something else


2. "manes tempus expergiscendi"

Manes= You remain , as Well as "the Soul"
Tempus, -oris n. (so it can only be accusative)
Expergiscendi, Gerundium genetive ~~ thus it belongs to Tempus


now tell me how you would bring the "Manes" in relation to the "Tempus Expergiscendi"

*hint*: it's Tempu and thus a ablative

[ZellDnicht]

Ok go further with your version, I'll go with mine.
Just one thing: it's dangerous in latin to focus only on the meaning because often (read: always) if you dont' look at the grammar, the meaning is completely different. That's the first thing you learn at school. Expecially for us, words are often similar to Italian, but have different meanings.

In my first verse i used UNTIL, that's not in the lyrics I know.
The second verse should be right, I think amandum comes from amare.
The third verse, I think I heard it correctly, I just forgot to translate the gerundium. It should be I will see you in the morning at the time of the awakening.

I translate closer to my words than you to yours, then please don't say in youtube that I have so a big amount of errors in my version, and if, show them.

[ZellDnicht]

"Omnia is pronounced that way, at least here in Germany :P"
IN ITALY TOO.

"1. "pavor omnifere pona"

Pavor = dread
Omnifere= doesn't exist
pona= doesn't exist"

I didn't have time to control this in the dictionary, so I didn't criticize it.

"2. "manes tempus expergiscendi"

Manes= You remain , as Well as "the Soul"
Tempus, -oris n. (so it can only be accusative)
Expergiscendi, Gerundium genetive ~~ thus it belongs to Tempus


now tell me how you would bring the "Manes" in relation to the "Tempus Expergiscendi"

*hint*: it's Tempu and thus a ablative"

Mane Tempu Expergiscendi = In the morning at the time of awakening.

[Vivisteiner]

Ok go further with your version, I'll go with mine.

We should do that. Right now, this is just getting tedious.

Anyway, Im sure that neither of our translations will be perfect, I guess we'll just have to wait till Squeenix releases the lyrics. The Latin is so hard to work out, so all we can do is wait. The final result will probably be a combination of both our translations.