Oh...
Someone punch me. I see it now.
Oh...
Someone punch me. I see it now.
...
Are we all reading the same books? Do y'all have any idea the depth Rowling goes to make her connections. Very nearly every word is important in these books, in order to get a complete grasp on the characters. A good friend of mine uses reference material to research these books thoroughly.
I'm not saying the books aren't targeted to children or aren't meant to be escapist entertainment. The wonderful, and powerful, thing about them is the fact that they work on multiple levels to touch many different audiences. Themes like love, self-reliance and friendship are very obvious, and are more for children. The other themes in the novels, especially the latest; acceptance of death, racism, redemption, inner conflict, openness, honesty, shame, are things that are difficult for most adults to read about, because they speak to us on a personal level.
So yes, they are escapist. But they're not meaningless.
Signature by rubah. I think.
I just finished it and I have to say that it had a most fitting ending.
(SPOILER)I liked how when Harry conversed with Dumbledore in his mind, it was reminiscent of how he'd always have those conversations with Dumbledore at the end of the books, with the exception of Half-Blood Prince.
As far as the epilogue goes, I liked the way it went. I know most fans wanted to know how the wizarding world faired afterwords, yet at the same time epilogues by nature tend to be quite short. The jump was nice revealing the obvious but at the same time it showed a bit more into the characters. Specifically the fact that Harry was able to finally understand Snape. I mean he named his youngest son after both Dumbledore and Snape, referring to the latter as a brave man. I did think it kinda creepy how Harry named two of his kids after his parents, then again I am named after my dad and granddad. (-__-
I think the way the sudden deaths of Tonks, Lupin and Fred were handled was proper. Harry had been too shocked by Fred's and pointedly avoided it; whilst when he discovered the other two dead, he had to move on, thus the story went the same way following Harry who had little time at the moment to mourn them. I am sure Rowling could have written extensively upon the matter if she wished, yet authors do not have that luxury with many constraints.
As far as comparing Harry Potter with say LotR and Tolkein's universe, I think that is unfair. Comparing most fantasy works to Tolkein's is decidedly unfair. Tolkein's work is vast and unparallelled in depth, while most fantasy series are limited to a handful of books. I do appreciate Rowling's ability to make the most obscure reference become of importance later on. She has quite the knack for it.
Overall, my feelings for Harry Potter and the Deathly Hallows are undecided, yet positive. I am not sure if it my most favourite book in the series but I'd have to say that it brings great completion to the series. For me, Harry Potter was started as a children's novel series and eventually grew into something more, something both children and adults can appreciate. It reminds me of how my roommate mentions that in Walt Disney movies, though made for kids, there are at times jokes that an older audience would get or notice. (Like in the Cars' commercial with the reference to the 60's, most kids watching the movie would not get it, though their older counterparts would).
Yes it's awful. But does the fact that it's a horrible thing make it a bad choice? War is not picky about casualties. I'm sure this has happened before in real life. Cant really blame the writer in that case. Maybe the fact that's so gut wrenching for you is actually a positive aspect of the writing.Originally Posted by Miriel
I personally (SPOILER)can't imagine George living his life properly after losing Fred. Maybe that's why Rowling didn't mention anything more about what happened with the loss of Fred, since I'm sure it would have been immeasurable how much pain George went through afterwards. They're twins! Omg, you can't split up twins. And that kind of grief probably wouldn't have tied in well with her uber sugar sweet ending. Oh man, Fred dying seriously depresses me.
As to the comparison of HP to Tolkien works... HP is not the most incredible literary stuff out there. There is surprisingly little left to the imagination. You don't have to go too far to make connections. It's filled with deus ex machina that is usually then explained away. However, I think it's just great. It's escapist reading at its best in my opinion. You don't have to go out of your way to enjoy it. It's absolutely enthralling quite often. I found myself on the edge of my seat with excitement trying to keep myself from skimming at times because I wanted to know what happened.
Tolkien's style is different. I'd say in general it lacks that by far. Perhaps I'm burnt out on it. It's also easy to look back at Tolkien's universe and think of it as vast compared to JK's, but that's a bit unfair (more on that later). You damn near have to study Tolkien and read his works continuously and in different orders to really put it all together. LOTR makes less sense without having read the Silmarillion and vice versa. You'd have to read each separately multiple times to really drink it in and then there's such a cast of characters that you could almost never remember them all in the early history of Middle-Earth. Tolkien is quite immersive and that's great, but I'd almost say it doesn't work as escapist literature unless you wanna get downright scholarly about reading it.
The universe of HP may not be finished. Whether JK writes any more books directly related to HP, she has left huge avenues to fill in on subjects like wandlore. Perhaps one day we'll look back on her works the way we look at Tolkien's universe. Perhaps they will be equally vast and deep (though I doubt it). I think perhaps she has deeper ideas for the world of HP than all we've seen in the books.
NOTE: I'm aware of the disputed nature of the Silmarillion among some Tolkien fans, but it is relevant to the backbone of the Tolkien universe.
You keep talking about the realities of war, but the reality is that it's a book. Written by a writer. And that writer has complete control of everything that happens in that book. Rowling chose who she wanted to kill. She could have killed anyone. But she chose, very specifically the people who were going to die. She made the choice. I disagree with the choices, so of course I can blame the writer. Who else is there to blame? I think it was a not cool choice. That's all.
I think the choices were right because many people care. (SPOILER)I mean, how many of you cared about the other deaths, like the teacher in the first chapter for example, or that Colin guy? I think the reactions we are seeing are the ones Rowling was aiming to get.
And about (SPOILER)the heroes using the Unforgivables, Lupin addressed that early on when be berated Harry for using Expeliarmus. They are at war.
Be that as it may, I believe that Rowling chose to make the book to reflect upon the realities of war because it was a war that was going on. I think it would've detracted from the flow of the battles themselves as well as the the life-or-death scenario that the duelists found themselves in. It would've been nice to grieve, but I think in terms of good reading it was better that we didn't. The conflict had been built up over the books as becoming more prominent and closer to home until it finally did hit home in the final books and so I think, given the trend, I think it was best treated that way. Besides, I don't think Rowling genuinely got any particular pleasure in killing off some of the characters she's built up, she just made the choices that she had to make.
Not my words Carol, the words of Top Gear magazine.
If she only killed people we didn't know or didn't care about, such as in Zante's example... it would be a pretty shallow book in my opinion. The casualties can't be only nameless and faceless. The fact that you're so worked up over that particular person's death probably says more in her favor than not. She hit a nerve and was evocative. I think that's a good thing and I doubt I'm alone.
I would not have cried had some random (SPOILER)house elf from the kitchen of Hogwarts had died. But I did cry when Dobby died. It was a blow, because I'd grown fond of him.
I never said that only side characters we don't care about should die. To be quite honest, (SPOILER)if ANY of the other Weasley's besides the twins had did, I would've been happier with how it all went down. And believe me, I love the whole Weasley clan. Even when it looked like Harry might bite it (and I cried at that part btw), I thought "ok, well that makes sense." If she wanted it to be completely realistic, she would have knocked out one of the Trio instead of having all three of them survive Voldy attacks again and again and again and then going on to have a bunch of kids.
I don't really see how this is a point that can be argued. It's not like anyone is arguing facts here. Some people are happy with the book, others are not quite so satisfied, still others hate the book. Whatev.
Also, I do think that this book will make for an excellent film. Moreso than any of the previous books.
Also also, Some of the icons people have been making for the 7th book are hilaaaaaarious. There sure are a lot of chuckles to be had in this book. IT IS I, REMUS JOHN LUPIN!! That's some crazy funny stuff right there.
Oh and one other thing. People have been saying that (SPOILER)Ginny was offering sex as Harry's birthday present. Wtf, is that the impression you people got? I just thought that the kiss was the present, but apparently, a lot of people think otherwise. Dunno, the scene didn't come off as "hey birthday boy, you wanna do it?" to me.
I agree with you about the present... I didn't read any more into it. I'm shocked to hear that anyone did. If that had been the case... I think more precaution may have been made... locking the door and such.
I also think Lupin was hilarious every time he showed up somewhere with that whole spiel of his.
As to the character in question, I just don't really see why he's more significant than any other. Yeah it sucks that he's a (SPOILER)twin, but it equally sucks that (SPOILER)Remus and Tonks have a new child that will never meet them. In the end, it is all subjective so I suppose it doesn't matter. I guess I just see it differently. But that's the glory of book and sharing opinions they evoke in us.
My fave bit had to be learning the story of (SPOILER)snape and (SPOILER)lily that was very sad and it made (SPOILER)snape so very brave.
(SPOILER)i mean i just knew to trust him, i just couldn't bare it if he was evil, i just could stop awwing at him crying on the floor at grimmauld place
i knew from the instant i read that (SPOILER)Tonks and Lupin had married that they or one of them would die, sniff, that was horrid, but it sorta puts Teddy in Harry's shoes, just with less quests and eveil wizards
...It is because there is a limit to time that we wish for nights that never dawn.Eternity is just an empty illusion and is why feelings of being able to believe in one another are born...Remember that well.
(SPOILER)I got the impression that they were about to do it too. They kissed plenty of times before, didn't they? So if it was only about a kiss, I don't think they would have made that a big deal out of it. Of course, Rowling couldn't have made it too obvious, but I think they would have gone all the way if Ron didn't surprise them.Oh and one other thing. People have been saying that (SPOILER)Ginny was offering sex as Harry's birthday present. Wtf, is that the impression you people got? I just thought that the kiss was the present, but apparently, a lot of people think otherwise. Dunno, the scene didn't come off as "hey birthday boy, you wanna do it?" to me.
Yeah i loved the book etc but there is one question that bugs me. Who was the non-magical character who was meant to 'do magic later in life, under desperate circumstances'?
there was a picture here
I didn't notice anyone, she might have changed her mind about that. She also said that (SPOILER)someone else was there when the Potters were killed, yet the book makes it pretty clear that Harry was the only one left alive.
Herminone appeared of an iconic figure in the book for me, and I was pleased to see that all their magical skills have thoroughly improved. Especially Ron's. They brought a lot entertaining ventures into the stratosphere of the book, and had a nice mixture of themes in the story as well. Including politics, war, and questing was very exhilarating for a reader; presenting thrills and a great sense of anticipation for the reader - usually leaving me craving to read the next line, paragraph, page or chapter.
I also like the way that Harry Potter sort of (SPOILER)turned into an admired man by the ladies! Even frightening off Ron about getting into Hermione's knickers!
A fabulous book, overall, and the best I've ever read. I would really like to a tribute installment for H.P from JKR, but I seriously doubt that would happen. (SPOILER)James, Albus and Lily sound like exciting young prosperous figures for the future. Especially Al!
Great book!
[foa]Double check your spoiler tags! -- foa[/foa]
EOFF needs a resurgence to it's former glory.
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