Then are you a fanit?Originally Posted by Avarice-ness
But I'm a girl!Avarice, I think I've just found us a suitable name.
Or am I? *Gogo's*
Then are you a fanit?But I'm a girl!Avarice, I think I've just found us a suitable name.
Or am I? *Gogo's*
Kefka.
If I was like Cloud I don't think I would have taken that test.
Changed to stop Jessweeee♪ from going insane. Is that better?
"You do realize" that I was referring to how Seph got torn apart in a few minutes in AC. As does Kefka in VI...You do realize that battle mechanics cannot be used while determining strength? It has to be storyline.Um, Hazz, Kefka in FFVI gets "torn apart in a matter of minutes"! He's by far the easiest FF boss in the series, especially considering you don't need to do a lengthy sidequest in order to kill him in 15 hits. Everytime I get to his final form, I win without getting touched. Whereas in Seph's final form, even if I'm rockin KOtR, I still get hit with that Supernova and have to recoup.
edit:
But none of that is neither here nor there. This is simply a continuation of the neverending quest of the SNESRPG Elitists to enshrine their games in an era in which better ones have already been made. Seriously, someone should make their testament with RPGMaker, embodying all their favorite games and everything they believe in, and I'm sure Cloud, Sephiroth, or Tidus would be the final boss. (they'd also have 1 HP).
If you went by battle mechanics then we would also have to say that Sin was not the most powerful thing in FFX because there are the area creation monsters, but that doesn't make sense within the story lines.
When comparing strength you use storyline data, not battle Mechanics.
Basically, you can't compare a movie to a game.
EOFF needs a resurgence to it's former glory.
Maybe torn apart in minutes for you. But, lets say someone bad plays? Then it could take a half hour...
Not to mention as Hazzard said (and I tried to point out), you cannot compare a movie to a game, they are different in all levels.
On the battle mechanics, as I recall the SNES couldn't support a higher HP total so Kefka was set to "regenerate" a certain amount of HP after being attacked until his "total" HP was reached. The one attack thing is due to coding issues.
If we want to compare power sources, Kefka gains his power from three diety-level otherworldly beings. Sephiroth gains his power from an alien (I happened to check the wikipedia article recently which states that Sephiroth was able to overpower Jenova and control Jenova. Considering Sephiroth isn't the most mentally stable, given his "generally cool guy to psycho in just three months!" thing and in terms of raw power, he was a genetically enhanced human). Kefka's obviously got the higher power source here.
And then we get down to combat and tactics. Kefka's crazy but he's also pretty crafty. Just judging from his character, I'd say Kefka's got this one in the bag.
Also, let's look at the groups that took either boss down (I'll even ignore FFVI's secret characters but not FFVII's, since the latter actually are involved in the plot).
Kefka is confronted by twelve people. Remember, you set your party order so that you can access all of them.
1. Terra, a young half-esper who received imperial training in combat.
2. Locke Cole, a reasonably young man who's been going into dungeons, fighting monsters and taking their stuff for several years. Lots of on-the-job training.
3. Cyan, a Knight retainer to his lord in Doma Castle.
4. Shadow. Freakin' Ninja.
5. Edgar. While the king and not as heavily combat-trained, a skilled machinist.
6. Sabin. Years of martial arts discipline under probably one of the greatest martial artists in the world. Trained in the mountain. Probably fought bears.
7. Celes, imperial general infused with magical energy. Since she wasn't under the slave crown, her training is probably even more complete than Terra's.
8. Strago, an old and experienced blue mage with knowledge of espers and powerful magic.
9. Relm, a young girl descended of the mage knights with the power to bring her paintings to life. Currently winning for least-impressive character.
10. Setzer, a gambler and airship owner. Instantly takes Relm's position for least impressive.
11. Mog, random cute thing that can summon the power of nature by dancing. Also, as this game tells us, Moogles are apparently quite skilled with various implements of killing you.
12. Gau, a young boy who grew up surrounded by monsters in the Veldt.
Now let's move on to FFVII. And in this one, it just takes three of the following.
Cloud, failed clone. Was a grunt in the Shinra army.
Tifa, young girl with martial arts training. Not a terrible fighter, but I'd definitely say she's nowhere near as well trained as Sabin, who was actively and constantly training.
Barret, an angry black man with a gun grafted to his arm. He's been doing the terrorist thing for a few years, but he doesn't have the martial background most of the FFVI characters have.
Red XIII, a member of an ancient race. He's young by his race's standards, and aside from his obvious physical advantage he wasn't really combat trained.
Cait Sith. Do I really need to say anything here?
Cid, a pilot who can inexplicably use a spear. Not really buying that this guy has a lot of training.
Yuffie. Also ninja, albeit an immature and bratty one. With a dash of thief as well. I'd say Shadow wins over her.
Vincent, a former turk vampire with a gun. I think he's impressed me the most in this lineup, and he's not even a required character.
And then we get to their source of power. Espers are otherworldy beings of great power. Materia is a naturally occurring substance refined to create magical effects, often reducing one's physical capabilities. Espers, on the other hand, actually ENHANCE their user as their user grows in strength.
Kefka just has the higher level of power here, and it took a LOT stronger (and bigger) team to take him down than Sephy.
Sephiroth's source of power is Jenova AND the Lifestream. Lifestream is the source of all magic and life in the world of FFVII, and Sephiroth actually suceeded in controlling it, in AC.
Well, this is only your opinion, and I will give my: I would say that if we give prep to them Kefka could win, but in a direct combat Sephiroth would be the winner.And then we get down to combat and tactics. Kefka's crazy but he's also pretty crafty. Just judging from his character, I'd say Kefka's got this one in the bag.
Avalanche are much better fighters than the Returners. AC and DoC proves that.Also, let's look at the groups that took either boss down (I'll even ignore FFVI's secret characters but not FFVII's, since the latter actually are involved in the plot).
Kefka is confronted by twelve people. Remember, you set your party order so that you can access all of them.
1. Terra, a young half-esper who received imperial training in combat.
2. Locke Cole, a reasonably young man who's been going into dungeons, fighting monsters and taking their stuff for several years. Lots of on-the-job training.
3. Cyan, a Knight retainer to his lord in Doma Castle.
4. Shadow. Freakin' Ninja.
5. Edgar. While the king and not as heavily combat-trained, a skilled machinist.
6. Sabin. Years of martial arts discipline under probably one of the greatest martial artists in the world. Trained in the mountain. Probably fought bears.
7. Celes, imperial general infused with magical energy. Since she wasn't under the slave crown, her training is probably even more complete than Terra's.
8. Strago, an old and experienced blue mage with knowledge of espers and powerful magic.
9. Relm, a young girl descended of the mage knights with the power to bring her paintings to life. Currently winning for least-impressive character.
10. Setzer, a gambler and airship owner. Instantly takes Relm's position for least impressive.
11. Mog, random cute thing that can summon the power of nature by dancing. Also, as this game tells us, Moogles are apparently quite skilled with various implements of killing you.
12. Gau, a young boy who grew up surrounded by monsters in the Veldt.
Now let's move on to FFVII. And in this one, it just takes three of the following.
Cloud, failed clone. Was a grunt in the Shinra army.
Tifa, young girl with martial arts training. Not a terrible fighter, but I'd definitely say she's nowhere near as well trained as Sabin, who was actively and constantly training.
Barret, an angry black man with a gun grafted to his arm. He's been doing the terrorist thing for a few years, but he doesn't have the martial background most of the FFVI characters have.
Red XIII, a member of an ancient race. He's young by his race's standards, and aside from his obvious physical advantage he wasn't really combat trained.
Cait Sith. Do I really need to say anything here?
Cid, a pilot who can inexplicably use a spear. Not really buying that this guy has a lot of training.
Yuffie. Also ninja, albeit an immature and bratty one. With a dash of thief as well. I'd say Shadow wins over her.
Vincent, a former turk vampire with a gun. I think he's impressed me the most in this lineup, and he's not even a required character.
In the story, Materia don't reduce the phisycal capabilities of anyone.And then we get to their source of power. Espers are otherworldy beings of great power. Materia is a naturally occurring substance refined to create magical effects, often reducing one's physical capabilities. Espers, on the other hand, actually ENHANCE their user as their user grows in strength.
Like I said before, AC and DoC proves that Avalanche are better fighters than the Returners.Kefka just has the higher level of power here, and it took a LOT stronger (and bigger) team to take him down than Sephy.
And Kefka having the higher level of power is just opinion. In my opinion, using the corrupted version of the source of magic in the world, to transform the planet in a dead vessel and use it to travell the universe, is much more impressive than destroying some cities with a light from the sky.
He managed to give Geostigma to some children. If he really managed to control all of Lifestream, Cloud wouldn't have been able to stop him, and Seph would have already won. But I would agree that he controlled maybe at least half of Lifestream, but not all.Sephiroth's source of power is Jenova AND the Lifestream. Lifestream is the source of all magic and life in the world of FFVII, and Sephiroth actually suceeded in controlling it, in AC.
Kefka does have more power than Sephiroth, but yeah, Seph would definitely rip Kefka to shreds with his sword. After all, power doesn't necessarily determines who would win a fight.Well, this is only your opinion, and I will give my: I would say that if we give prep to them Kefka could win, but in a direct combat Sephiroth would be the winner.
Isn't this also an opinion as well, since you have yet to actually explain what this "proof" is?Avalanche are much better fighters than the Returners. AC and DoC proves that.
And I don't know about DoC, but Avalanche didn't really seem to do much in AC. Avalanche beat a few monsters. Cloud was the one who actually defeated Kadaj, Yazoo, Loz, Bahamut, and Sephiroth.
And terrorizing the world for many years is more impressive than infecting a few children with Geostigma.And Kefka having the higher level of power is just opinion. In my opinion, using the corrupted version of the source of magic in the world, to transform the planet in a dead vessel and use it to travell the universe, is much more impressive than destroying some cities with a light from the sky.
Aeris probably controlled enough to keep Sephiroth beatable. But Kefka didn't have a monopoly of magic either, so they're most likely even in terms of power.
And if Kefka was foolish enough to engage the Returners in direct combat rather than smite them from afar, there's no reason why he wouldn't do the same against Sephiroth.Kefka does have more power than Sephiroth, but yeah, Seph would definitely rip Kefka to shreds with his sword. After all, power doesn't necessarily determines who would win a fight.Well, this is only your opinion, and I will give my: I would say that if we give prep to them Kefka could win, but in a direct combat Sephiroth would be the winner.
They took down that big freakin' dragon. I didn't see the Returners do anything even remotely as impressive.Isn't this also an opinion as well, since you have yet to actually explain what this "proof" is?Avalanche are much better fighters than the Returners. AC and DoC proves that.
Aeris defeated Yazoo and Loz, iirc. Cloud used the other seven as launching pads for his fatal strike on Bahamut.And I don't know about DoC, but Avalanche didn't really seem to do much in AC. Avalanche beat a few monsters. Cloud was the one who actually defeated Kadaj, Yazoo, Loz, Bahamut, and Sephiroth.
Many years? It was just one. And infecting people with Geostigma was not Seph's ultimate ability.And terrorizing the world for many years is more impressive than infecting a few children with Geostigma.And Kefka having the higher level of power is just opinion. In my opinion, using the corrupted version of the source of magic in the world, to transform the planet in a dead vessel and use it to travell the universe, is much more impressive than destroying some cities with a light from the sky.
This is a signature.
He give Geostigma to many people in the world(adults and childrens). This is very clear in "On a Way to a Smile".
And Omega Weapon/Weiss has most of the Lifestream in the world. But if he isn't above Sephiroth(because nothing in FFVII is), then that means Sephiroth has controll over the majority of the Lifestream too, because it is the source of power.
Well, when I see "Who is more powerfull" I think in everything, not just magic power. For example, Sephiroth can speedblitz Kefka and kill him, so in my point of view, he is more powerful than Kefka, he is above Kefka, he is the winner of the fight. Sephiroth can beat him, he is the superior one... The most powerful of them.Kefka does have more power than Sephiroth, but yeah, Seph would definitely rip Kefka to shreds with his sword. After all, power doesn't necessarily determines who would win a fight.
And I have a qurestion to you. Do you believe Kefka is more powerful than Omega Weapon of DoC? The same one composed of most of the Lifestream in the planet? Because when you see Sephiroth in a battle, you have to remember that he is at least in the level of Omega. "There is nothing above him", remember.
The proof is the movie itself, and FMVs of DoC. The fights in the Matrix are a joke compared to the fights in AC. The Returners can't fight like that.Isn't this also an opinion as well, since you have yet to actually explain what this "proof" is?
Did you watch the movie? Tifa fighting Loz, Avalanche fighting Bahamut, Cloud(he is part of Avalanche, remember?) kicking the ass of everyone. All that WITHOUT Materia.And I don't know about DoC, but Avalanche didn't really seem to do much in AC. Avalanche beat a few monsters. Cloud was the one who actually defeated Kadaj, Yazoo, Loz, Bahamut, and Sephiroth.
Now, think about the end of FFVII, when they could do all those things and were FULL of the most powerful Materias in the world... FFVII Sephiroth was defeated by THIS group.
Like I said before, it wasn't only children. And Kefka terrorized the world, so what? Do you thing this matter in a FIGHT?And terrorizing the world for many years is more impressive than infecting a few children with Geostigma.
Oh I see, you're using a movie and FMV's from a game that can be highly exaggerated as proof, Got cha. How shall we ever disprove such evidence that isn't in any way exaggerated?!
Everything presented in the movie and game(DoC) is cannon, you liking it or not.
I'm certainly not liking it, you could make up something and if it was cannon'd then it's automatically TRUE AND UN-ESCAPABLE. The cannon is flawed.
Edit: I'll always think of DoC and Advent Children as an insult to entertainment media and completely exaggerated beyond truth.
You can think whatever you want Raebus. But remember that FFVII is their story, and only they have the authority to decide what is cannon and what isn't.
I don't want to offend you, but what SE say about their story, is more important than your opinion about it.
But what I'm really saying in this thread, is... In my opinion, Sephiroth wins.
and I think that my opinion > All, even SE.
I'm not changing my opinion, ever.
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