Yeah I'm sure Ben and Widmore are both evil, just evil against each other as well.
This episode was meh. It answered some things but I don't like when there isn't a lot of action on the island.
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Yeah I'm sure Ben and Widmore are both evil, just evil against each other as well.
This episode was meh. It answered some things but I don't like when there isn't a lot of action on the island.
What building was Ceasar in at the beginning? If they are on the island I don't remember there being a place with a desk oO
Everything had the Hydra symbol on it - I'm assuming they are on the Hydra island.Quote:
Originally Posted by McLovin'
I've grown tired of the "Ben double crossed someone!" plot line. When he strangled Locke last night I groaned.
I'm in agreement with others in that I've come to the conclusion that Whitmore and Ben are both evil and using everyone and the island for their own selfish means. Perhaps this is why the island reached out to Locke, as he's pure and truly cares for the island above his own interests, even his life. Plus the island hooked him up with a new pair of legs so he probably feels he owes the island now.
Btw, since the plane landed on Hydra Island it would be safe to assume that it landed on that runway that they were building in season 3!!!
Regarding why Ben killed Locke, I have a number of conflicting ideas. First of all it's quite likely that he knew Locke would actually try to fulfil his promise to Jin not to bring Sun back if he remained alive. Secondly, after watching the scene twice, it looks like he has no idea how to get back to the island until Locke tells him. One possibility is that Hawking is actually being employed by Widmore to help the O6 get back to the island, with no idea that Ben is supposed to be kept away from it. However, the real change in his mood seems to come when he learns that Jin is still alive. It is possible that these two tidbits of information combine to cause him to decide to kill John, although I am still uncertain as to why this would be.
I don't think he expected Locke to be resurrected, however.
As for Widmore's claim to have protected the island "in a non-violent way", that's obviously bull:skull::skull::skull::skull: given his order to chop off Juliet's hands. I wouldn't trust anything either Ben or Widmore says; both of them are pretty clearly more interested in their own power than in telling the truth.
The labyrinthine twists and turns of this show really are coming to match those of the Illuminatus! trilogy, an acknowledged influence on the series. It's also where the number 23 comes from, although the creators haven't explicitly acknowledged that part yet.
We also must remember, from "The Shape of Things to Come," that Widmore says very matter-of-factly, "That Island's mine, Benjamin... It will be again." It's plain to me now that Widmore has no intention of letting Locke lead anything.
Good call; I had forgotten about that
I wish! That would be a good way to explain away that loose end. But no, the plane is visible just chillin' on top of a tree bough in one scene of the last episode. I'm still pretty damned sure that runway is for aliens . . . aliens like Mrs. Hawking (dun dun dun).Quote:
Originally Posted by McLovin'
Yeah, I don't think Ben was planning on killing John. I think he realized he had to after John was all "no man Sun is just staying here."Quote:
Originally Posted by The Man
Locke's mention of Mrs. Hawking also had something to do with Ben's motivation.
So I don't think he went to John with the explicit intention of killing him - after he does, he's pretty remorseful ("I'll miss you John, I really will.").
My wife read a theory somewhere that Kate is pregnant with Jack's baby, thus recreating Claire's pregnancy on the flight. Since Kate and Jack "landed" on the island in the 70s, the theory suggests that Kate has the baby while in that time and we know/knew the baby as an adult "Other" in the present time.
Not a bad theory; I could see it being true.
Richard Alpert?Quote:
Originally Posted by Flying Mullet
I think Richard is some immortal manifestation of the island, as he's appeared the same age from the 1950's through present time, but you never know.
More interesting theories from the asoiaf boardQuote:
Originally Posted by Raidne [url="http://asoiaf.westeros.org/index.php?s=&showtopic=34015&view=findpost&p=1702651"
Yeah, that's what I think too ... although, by KatexJack+Baby theory I think it could be him. He could be hoppin around through time n' all.Quote:
Originally Posted by Flying Mullet
The reason Richard is ageless seems pretty obvious. I mean he probably can't age in a time where he hasn't been born so he can't age till he catches up with his real timeline.
Either that or he's just undead like Christian and now Locke are.
OK, seriously:
Where the hell are Rose and Bernard?
smurf knows. My crackpot theory is that they're the people who become Adam and Eve, which, if true, probably means that it'll be awhile until we know for certain.
Two weeks until the next episode. FFFFFFFFFFFFUUUUUUUUUUUUU
After seeing the statue and rewinding and pausing to get a closer look, my wife and I decided that it looked like an Egyptian god from the back. Now I'm wondering if the island "lived" in the Mediterranean during ancient Egyptian times and was moved at some point. When the Oceanic 6 watched it "move", it looked like it sank, and this could be the show's explanation of where the Atlantis legend comes form.
Definitely an Egyptian God. It was just one of the many Egyptian symbols that we got from this episode (and others). The statue is holding ankhs in each hand, and Paul had the ankh, as well. We also have the prominence of Horace (Horus). Remember the timer in the hatch went to hieroglyphics after it hit 0 in Season 2.Quote:
Originally Posted by Flying Mullet
The temple of the smoke monster was also covered in Egyptian hieroglyphics.Quote:
Originally Posted by KirobaitoDefinitely an Egyptian God. It was just one of the many Egyptian symbols that we got from this episode (and others). The statue is holding ankhs in each hand, and Paul had the ankh, as well. We also have the prominence of Horace (Horus). Remember the timer in the hatch went to hieroglyphics after it hit 0 in Season 2.Quote:
Originally Posted by Flying Mullet
Overall I enjoyed that episode, especially Sawyer and Alpert's interaction. I love how Richard Alpert is totally just running into people all over time who are like "yeaaaaah, so uh I'm from the future."
So the Hostiles and Dharma had a truce? I wonder what actually broke it, if anything, to cause Alpert to seek Ben to cause the Purge.
Also:
SAWYERxJULIET FTW.
edit: Oh, and a baby was born on the Island! Sawyer told Juliet that whatever caused the baby deaths may not have happened yet - maybe it was something that Dharma did that caused the baby dying?
edit again: And Charlotte is alive again! But a child. So obviously Dan is going to threaten her not to return to the Island and fail.
Absolutely. I figured that was a given when she told him that she recognized him as that scary man who told her to stay away from the island as she was dying. Plus the season premier showed Faraday on the island working with Dharma during the 70's, so it wasn't so much "if" as "how".Quote:
Originally Posted by Moon Rabbits
What if the baby is Jacob? Jacob is special apparently since he was born but shouldn't have been presumably (Amy was supposed to die?). And Horace is shown building Jacob's cabin...maybe they see that their son is something else and needed to lock him away or something.
Doubtful. In 1954, Locke tells Richard that "Jacob sent me," and that got Richard to listen. Jacob is already known by that time, so unless we have more time travel, Jacob is far older than that little boy.Quote:
Originally Posted by McLovin'
I can't be the only one who was waiting for this conversation to happen:
"We need to go back."
"Back where?"
"Back...to the future!"
This show is too weird for me these days. So is everyone from the original crash besides the main cast dead? Where are Rose, Bernard, and Claire?
Rose and Bernard are MIA. Claire was last seen with Christian Shephard, which leads me to suspect that she was simply immune to the time jumps. I'm sure we'll see her again.
Also yeah, the creators are definitely strongly implying that the island has some connection with Egypt. There's even a crackpot theory that the island is actually Atlantis, though I'm not sure I buy that.
I read somewhere on these fine inter-connected tubes that the actress who plays Claire (I think her name is Emilie de Ravin? Something like that) didn't sign on to do Season 5 and only has a bit part role, but she will return as a regular for Season 6.
Yea they said she will be back in season 6.
KATE YOU WILL RUIN EVERYTHING GTFO ALREADY >(
Everything? Do you mean the 41 minutes Sawyer and Juliet have been dating? :D
they're probably saving her for jack anyway and need someone else to tame sawyer.
I bet Kate and Juliet hook up before the show's end.
That's an ending I could get behind
naw but I mean she's been messing around Jack and Sawyer since the first episode and it's getting tired and boring and she needs to make her goddamn mind up and stop ruining their everything else >(
he was wittering to himself that he wasn't going to do it, he wasn't going to tell her.Quote:
Originally Posted by Moon Rabbits
but he has gone a bit of the hinges and was shaken up by seeing her again, who knows
he was breaking my heart tho while he was crying in the jungle. I love that he's so broken up about it and they didn't fluke out like they sort of did with Claire/charlie.
I was dreading Sawyer and Juliet, but goddammit, i love it. They are so cute together
We do know that he'll tell her, because we know that he does. That's the wonders of having a time travel mythos that makes sense. :pQuote:
Originally Posted by PeneloRatsbanehe was wittering to himself that he wasn't going to do it, he wasn't going to tell her.Quote:
Originally Posted by Moon Rabbits
but he has gone a bit of the hinges and was shaken up by seeing her again, who knows
he was breaking my heart tho while he was crying in the jungle. I love that he's so broken up about it and they didn't fluke out like they sort of did with Claire/charlie.
I was dreading Sawyer and Juliet, but goddammit, i love it. They are so cute together
Why did it show last week's episode instead of a new one?
There won't be a new episode until the following Wednesday.Quote:
Originally Posted by Del Murder
Blasphemy!Quote:
Originally Posted by Moon Rabbits
I already knew there would be no episode this week, but yeah it sucks.
little Ben is back :D
They said there would be a new Lost in two weeks at the end of last week's episode.
That's the problem with Lost, you work so hard on paying attention during the show that you have nothing left after it's over. :p
I assumed that since it started in January that there wouldn't be any reruns.
How in hell did Ben know there was a boat there?
Ben knows everything.
Awesome episode. I especially liked Sawyer telling Jack off towards the end. That was priceless.
Crackpot theory of the now (again from the asoiaf boards):
Also, I can't have been the only one that saw the smoke monster when (SPOILER)Sun and Frank returned to the main island. I'm pretty sure I also heard it right before the turbulence started as well. No idea what either of those signifies, though.Quote:
(SPOILER)Sayid shoots kid Ben.
You heard it here first, people. He has no idea about the "rules." He may think he's saving everyone in the future...but that shot of him with the gun, and him saying "I know now what I have to do..." I think that may have something to do with why Ben goes all...sociopath leader in his future. Also thinking that Jack is going to have to save him (again), but perhaps covertly? Since he is a workman, and all. (:p)
I caught that too...Quote:
Originally Posted by The Man
Yeah, I was thinking that Ben was going to get killed and :bou::bou::bou::bou: was gonna get smurfed up ... because I think Sun and Frank are in "present" time on the Island, because the Dharma Initiative symbols were still up all over the barracks. The others took the barracks over after the Purge, so they would have (presumably) taken down the Dharma symbols. So, maybe the future was changed?Quote:
Originally Posted by The Man
Either that, or Hurley tells Horace that Ben is going to kill everyone with the poison gas ... he mentioned it in this episode, didn't he?
Miles is totally Pierre Chang's son.
here here! Sawyer saved their ass and all he got was "what are you gonna do next" or "i got people off the island" line! Jack got schooled lol!Quote:
Originally Posted by The Man
I really doubt the past is actually going to be changed. Sayid won't know that though, which could strongly screw :bou::bou::bou::bou: up :monster:
Anyway yeah, Sun, Frank and the others are definitely in 'present' time. Also, I doubt Ben dies as a result of an encounter with the monster, though he does seem to be in a bad way at the end of The Life and Death of Jeremy Bentham. The writers did say they were going to kill off one major character this season though, and I suppose Ben is a possibility. I'd kind of hate it if it were him though; Michael Emerson brings so much to the series.
About the death: (SPOILER)Its not Ben
They're in 2007 and apparently Smokey continued to destroy the Barracks after Ben released it in 2005.
Loving Christian appearances almost as much as I love Smokey. <3
I wouldn't mind if Ben died. I'm a bit tired of his manipulation and double-crossing these days. He's become too one-note for me, though that's not to insult Emerson, who is a very good actor and all. If I were a badass like Sayid, I would have shot his ass long ago.
Ben is the new Snape...
Oh and Jack was such an ass this episode, he got what was coming to him...
This show is too bizarre for words these days. Why didn't Sun go back in time with the rest of them?
My wife suspects that someone from the Oceanic Six went back in time if someone from that time wanted them back. Thus Juliet -> Jack and Sawyer -> Kate. But if this is true, who wanted Hurley and Sayid back? And is there a point in time when this "calculation" was made as now Sawyer and Juliet seem pretty content without Jack and Kate unless it's at some unconscious level.
Sun didn't go back because her purpose in this timeline is to do something in 2007 while the rest of the Losties were meant to influence the DHARMA time period causing it to become what it is now.
I think both of those theories are pretty crappy but one of them is probably right. I still want to know when/where Rose and Bernard are too. Are those the only people left alive from the original crash?
Sun didn't go back in time because she was pregnant when she left the island, and wasn't pregnant when she came back. At least, that's my theory.
That doesn't make sense because they weren't trying to recreate the circumstances of how they left the island, but how they came to the island first. But you could be right because this show obviously doesn't need to make a lot of sense.
I don't enjoy this theory at all, but it seems plausible. Sayid x Hurley sort of don't fit, though. Then again, Sawyer and Hurley were buddy buds, I doubt that's why though. Maybe Charlie wanted Hurley to go back to the 70s?Quote:
Originally Posted by Flying Mullet
Blech. I think the Island just sent the O6 where they were supposed to go to fix the problem.
Well, Mrs. Hawking said that if they didn't "all" come back, then the results would be "unpredictable." Presumably that meant Ji Yeon, (possibly) Aaron (though the "don't you dare bring him back" suggests otherwise in his case, but I have a sneaking suspicion that Claire actually meant Ben instead), and Desmond as well. In fact I'm thinking it's going to be Desmond returning that fixes everything. We still don't know what Ben was doing at the docks but I'm pretty sure whatever it was was designed to lure him back to the island.Quote:
Originally Posted by Del Murder
i just hope they dont do a whole time loop storyline where they never get back to 2007 and are stuck in the 70s and 1 of them becomes jacob and 2 of them become adam and eve and the rest do whatever they want (die in the purge maybe) and then it shows the plan crashing again in 2004 so its just an inevitable time loop, thatd be a cop out if you ask me... although im pretty convinced that jacob, adam and eve all must be characters we already know so its quite likely something like that will happen
they need to escape the 70s, go back to 2007 and get involved in a war between ben and widmore
This seems so sadly likely.Quote:
Originally Posted by Craig
Also: Jacob = Jack, Adam and Eve = Rose and Bernard.
Rose and Bernard being Adam and Eve seems a little..disappointing? Being Jack and Kate would be more effective than just having it randomly be Rose and Bernard.
Pretty sure they will get out of the 70s before the series ends. There's still another whole season left. They aren't going to spend the whole thing in the 70s, especially when a few of the characters are still in the present.
Well, yeah, I don't actually expect it to be Rose and Bernard, but I hope it is. It would be a cute way to end their story - I mean, they had all these emotional (and health) problems off the Island, and when they came to the Island it all got fixed. It would be cute, I say~!Quote:
Originally Posted by McLovin'
But, the producers said that Adam and Eve will "prove they had it all planned out from the beginning," so I doubt it's actually Rose and Bernard because that explains nothing, really.
Weren't Adam and Eve inside plane seats, too? I wonder how that's going to be explained. Maybe Jack and Kate have been dead all along!
Also @Del, concerning the timeline: (SPOILER)I read a spoiler that said, towards the end of this season, the Donkey Wheel gets turned again. Presumably this fixes all the time travel issues.
Concerning spoilers, I also read one of these people will die by the end of the season: (SPOILER) Ben, Miles, Daniel, Sawyer, or Jin. Personally, I think it's going to be either Ben or Jin. Miles has had far too little of his background explained, Sawyer's character is still developing, and Daniel is required to explain all the "sciencey" crap on the Island. Ben's character feels like he's reaching the end of his character arc, learning to "trust" and "be trusted" and whatnot (+ he was all wounded when Locke is resurrected); Jin, too, seems like he has reached the end of his character arc - he learned to trust Sun, sacrificed his own happiness/freedom to keep her away from the Island, and has just become a very strong character all around. Not only that, but not letting Sun and Jin reunite would be the most tragic thing ever.
EDIT: Also, wtf@Aaron? I'm really curious to know what Kate did with him before leaving and how that will affect the story on the Island.
Kate and Hurley should really just stay in the past forever since they're both wanted for murder and all. Not much left for Jack or Sayid either. Sun and Jin needs to go back to the present to be with their baby.
and the shocking twist in the end of this episode was the least shocking twist yet. :/
Since it's probably gonna be a finale death I would say it has to be (SPOILER) Sawyer or Ben since if it was Jin, Daniel or Miles I don't think fans would care that much and a death at a finale should be major.Quote:
Originally Posted by Moon Rabbits
You mean Kate and Sawyer? Hurley was cleared of all charges.Quote:
Originally Posted by Levian
Not to mention, I doubt any of them will ever leave the island again, nor will American law enforcement have any interest in visiting it, so they're safe. Well, as safe as you can get on that island anyway.
Who are Adam and Eve and why are they significant? I have a vague recollection of it but not much.
adam and eve were 2 skeletons jack found in the caves way back in season 1. jack found a pair of white and black stones in their pockets or something.
the producers have said that that by the time lost ends, adam and eve being in season 1 will be evidence that they had certain things planned all along, which basically means before lost ends a male and female character in the past are going to get a hold of black and white stones, go to the caves and die and everybody will go "ohhhh so thats who adam and eve were"
Oh? I don't remember that at all. Shows how much I've been paying attention this season. :DQuote:
Originally Posted by The ManYou mean Kate and Sawyer? Hurley was cleared of all charges.Quote:
Originally Posted by Levian
Not to mention, I doubt any of them will ever leave the island again, nor will American law enforcement have any interest in visiting it, so they're safe. Well, as safe as you can get on that island anyway.
But now that you mention it, Kate got her charges dropped too.
Sawyer is wanted for murder? I thought he did his time.
Yeah, afaik none of them are criminals anymore, technically.Quote:
Originally Posted by LevianOh? I don't remember that at all. Shows how much I've been paying attention this season. :DQuote:
Originally Posted by The ManYou mean Kate and Sawyer? Hurley was cleared of all charges.Quote:
Originally Posted by Levian
Not to mention, I doubt any of them will ever leave the island again, nor will American law enforcement have any interest in visiting it, so they're safe. Well, as safe as you can get on that island anyway.
But now that you mention it, Kate got her charges dropped too.
Sawyer is wanted for murder? I thought he did his time.
Except Sayid.
He's wanted for something, I don't remember what. Might be that dude he killed in Australia.Quote:
Originally Posted by LevianOh? I don't remember that at all. Shows how much I've been paying attention this season. :DQuote:
Originally Posted by The ManYou mean Kate and Sawyer? Hurley was cleared of all charges.Quote:
Originally Posted by Levian
Not to mention, I doubt any of them will ever leave the island again, nor will American law enforcement have any interest in visiting it, so they're safe. Well, as safe as you can get on that island anyway.
But now that you mention it, Kate got her charges dropped too.
Sawyer is wanted for murder? I thought he did his time.
And yeah I didn't even think about Kate not being inprisoned, but then again since she left the state her parole will be violated. If they can prove she left it that is, but they probably could.
Sawyer isn't wanted for anything, unless they found out who killed Frank Duckett.
He seemed pretty certain they would, which was why he didn't want to go back. Now that I think about it though he may have been wanted for something else, but I can't remember.
what was with the woman behind Sun, while she was talking to Christian? that was so spooky, i loved it. who was it?
My bets on Charlotte, 1. as shes a deady now, 2. it looked like her and 3. it was her who warned them about not letting sun get back
or claire, but that would mean shes actually dead
yknow whats weird.. i was at the pub with my girlfriend earlier, and that speech sawyer gave to jack, about sawyer being a thinker and jack reacting popped into my head. i told this to my gf (whos only watched the first 3 seasons) and asked her what she thought.
she was like, jack was a crap leader i dont like him (bear in mind shes only watched seasons 1-3 but already this is clear to her). he made so many bad decisions and people died because of him... sawyer seems a lot more level headed than him
i pretty much agreed with her and said jack was too interested in getting off the island and proving locke wrong to see the truth, but despite that i cant help but think he is awesome because his way of thinking brings a lot of conflict to the show.
i still think he will get back in control, or at least share control with sawyer. especially if they manage to make their way back to 2007
Jack did the best he could. It didn't work out well but he stepped up, i mean s.1 sawyer wasn't going to do it was he. the characters have grown and changed with time. I used to Love kate and now she hasn't got Aaron i've gone off of her, i liked her as a mum more.
There were a lot of role reversals in the past episode that have set up the next few for a lot of conflict between the survivors.Quote:
Originally Posted by Craig
Jack and Sawyer, obviously, have switched roles. Jack is now an advocate for faith and fate, whereas Sawyer has taken on the "man of science" (or rather, man of thought) sort of role that Jack used to fill.
Sayid and Ben have switched roles too. Remember in season 2, when Sayid had Ben captured in the Swan? Now Sayid is the captive and (young) Ben is not. Ben also lied about not being one of the Others (and was one), whereas Sayid is lying about being a Hostile (when he is not).
Kate and Juliet's dynamic has also changed. At first, they both wanted Jack and Kate already "had" him, really. Now, both want Sawyer, but Kate is the one with the disadvantage (Juliet and Sawyer have had a three year relationship at this point in the timeline).
Other, less obvious ones also exist - Ben, seemingly telling the truth, is betrayed by Sun. And, with concern to Jin and Sun's relationship, Jin has often been the 'go-getter,' where Sun has sort of been a submissive 'damsel in distress' type character. Now, Jin is completely hopeless in actually finding Sun, whereas Sun has become a crazy hard-ass badass biznatch bent on saving her husband.
And where is Daniel Faraday? I don't remember him in the past few episodes. Maybe I am just forgetting his scenes?
daniel faraday is away right now. i think in one scene sawyer mentioned to jack that faraday had some theories on what they couldnt do in regard to time travel. jack was like, "faradays here?" sawyer basically said "not anymore"
so hes gone off somewhere
Just because she shows up behind Christian doesn't mean she's dead.Quote:
Originally Posted by PeneloRatsbane
That said, there's speculation that the woman behind Christian wasn't actually supposed to be in the shot and that it was just an error :monster:
@ moon rabbits, nice analysis, I hadn't noticed a lot of that but you're right. The writers do love irony.
Sun or Lapidus probably would have spotted her, i figured when the door opened the ghosty lass came in. she's to visible for it to be an accident, and if it were they should included it cos it chilled me bones, very creppy.
I keep imagining that Daniel has gone crazy and is now living as some mad old hermit in a cave somewhere XD
That person behind Sun when Jack's father was talking to her and Frank was strange, kind of creepy - it could have just been an error, but surely it would have been spotted before the show went to air.
Sawyer got deported because he punched a government official, IIRC. In Australia, he didn't get caught for killing the shrimp dude, only for punching someone, which we didn't see.
I recon Faraday is loafing around somewhere, but he probably is a little nuts now. Which is fair enough, imagine losing the woman u love, then meeting her again in a matter of hours only she's like 3 or something. That would mess up anyone, but Faraday already had a head start in crazy. I recon he's probably going to mess around with the Orchid and cause something to happen
It was already established that Claire is with Christian, wasn't it? Last season, when John was told to move the Island, Claire was chilling in the cabin with Christian. At least, that's what I remember.Quote:
Originally Posted by The ManJust because she shows up behind Christian doesn't mean she's dead.Quote:
Originally Posted by PeneloRatsbane
EDIT: Oh, and what about Aaron being raised by another? Wasn't Claire's psychic REALLY adamant about her being the one to raise the child? > _ < So many questions.
edit edit: So I was reading Lostpedia because I do that when I'm bored (I'm so cool), and it said that Richard Malkin (the psychic) later told Claire she should give her baby up for adoption to a couple in Los Angeles who were "good people." Perhaps the same good people that Kate wound up giving Aaron to in Los Angeles, or maybe Malkin worked for Widmore or Ben and had some ulterior motive?
EDIT AGAIN:
Concerning Jacob! ~
Jacob is an important biblical figure. The biblical story of Jacob has many parallels to the story of Lost:
Jacob and Esau are twins.
Jacob's mother Rebekah received a prophecy from God after she began to experience pain and discomfort during her pregnancy (pregnancy troubles! Sounds like the Island). God told her that she would birth twins, whom would fight with one another their entire lives. Not only this, but the prophecy says that neither will rise to power at the same time - when one gains power, the other will lose it. God also tells her the younger child will be served by the older.
When the twins are born, Esau is birthed first; strong, covered in hair, and developed (in fact, his name means "developed" or "fully grown" in Hebrew). Jacob is birthed second, clutching the heel of his brother Esau.
Esau becomes a hunter, adored by his father Isaac, while Jacob becomes a "tent-dweller" (cabin-dweller?). Being feeble, and less outgoing than his brother, Jacob is favored by Rebekah.
One day, tired from hunting, Esau begs Jacob for some stew which he has prepared. Jacob agrees only to give the stew to his brother if Esau gives up his birthright. Esau agrees, and eats.
Eventually, Isaac grows old and becomes blind. Esau goes hunting and prepares to be blessed by his father before his death. Rebekah, knowing that Esau still plans to keep his birthright, remembers God's prophecy and knows that Jacob is the one who should rightly receive the birthright (as Esau is meant to serve Jacob). They wind up deceiving Isaac, since he is blind, and Jacob becomes the blessed one. Soon enough, Esau returns from the hunt and Isaac learns he has been deceived - however, he does not retract his blessing and tells Esau that he shall serve Isaac. Another interesting note: it is said that Isaac smelled Heaven when Jacob would enter his room, where he would smell Hell when Esau entered.
SO - I postulate that Jacob of Lost, obviously, is an allusion to the Jacob of biblical origin. Likewise, Widmore is Esau. Remember, Widmore has said multiple times that the Island is rightfully his, and is evidently angered by his (possibly) wrongful exiling. Widmore, like Esau, also uses excessive force and is a "hunter" type of person.
Anyway~ Esau swears vengeance upon Jacob, so Jacob flees. Eventually, he falls in love with Rachael (who is actually his cousin ... :Oo:), but Rachael's father Laban's got a problem with this. He deceives Jacob into marrying his older daughter, Leah, as it was not proper at the time for the younger daughter to marry first. Really, Jacob loves Rachael, but Rachael is barren and cannot have children (like on the Island, again), but God opens up Leah's womb and she gives birth to four children in succession. Eventually Laban lets Jacob marry Rachael, too, who gives Jacob her handmaid so they may have children. Long story short, Jacob sires about 36143861871 kids by Leah, Rachael's handmaid, and Leah's handmaid (both of whom are said to be even younger daughters of Laban. Yeah, incest all over the place). Oh, and God let's Rachael have a kid, too, his name is Joseph. *Phew* One of these children is named Daniel (Faraday?~)
Jacob winds up pissing off Laban by stealing the good portions of his sheep herd, and he and his wives peace out before long. As Jacob and his family are about to leave Canaan, Esau's kingdom, Rachael gives birth to Jacob's twelfth son, Benjamin. She dies in labor.
Now, we all know Ben's mother died in labor. I find it interesting that, although Ben's father is obviously not Jacob, Ben's mother died off of the Island (let's say "Widmore's territory"). So, Rachael is much like Ben's mother, as she died within Esau's territory (Canaan).
Anyway, Jacob had one son named Levi. Levi begat Kohath begat Amram begat Aaron. Aaron's mother, Jochebed, is Levi's daughter. If Levi is Christian, then Jochebed is Claire. This would explain why Jacob employs Christian as his "messenger" type, and why he takes Claire. Anyway, Jesus is a descendant of Jacob. Charlie had a vision of Claire dressed as the Virgin Mary (in Season 2, I think?), holding Aaron. If this is the case, then maybe Aaron = Jesus = the Island's savior?
Oh, and God loved Jacob but hated Esau. For this reason, I put forth that Richard Alpert = God.
Joseph, btw, was also Jacob's favorite son and Benjamin's only full brother. Ben Linus has remarked several times about how Locke is the Lost Jacob's "favorite." In Ben's lifetime, he also saw a tribe of his women and children murdered, after which the survivors could no longer produce children. Their solution? Kill another tribe's men and steal their women / children, ala Lost.
[/long winded theorizing]
I just re-watched the scene where Christian is showing Sun and Frank the picture and I didn't see anyone behind him. Can someone provide some clues/hints as to where/when she is?
So is Walt just going to be appearing randomly for the rest of this thing or is he going to go back to the island? And are we all assuming Charlotte is going to come magically back to life? And is that Charlie's guitar Hurley has been carrying around?
My God I love this show.
http://1.bp.blogspot.com/_n3eH1jI8AZ...sun+woman2.jpgQuote:
Originally Posted by Flying Mullet
again, nice theorising/research. a lot of that makes a lot of sense.Quote:
Originally Posted by Moon Rabbits
Thanks. I was re-watching the episode on abc.com and didn't see her so my guess is that it was a production goof and they removed her from the background before putting the episode online.
Reaction to the last thirty seconds: :eek: --> :confused:
Hahaha, yeeees.
I knew he was going to do that, and I was pretty sure it would be at the end of the episode. Ben will survive though, obviously :monster:
That was nuts. I wonder how Ben will come back.
Speculation is that the Others or Jack give him surgery, or else the island just heals him on its own as it did with Locke.
Also, how big are Ben's balls? Seriously. Knowing Sayid's true nature, and that he eventually ends up trying to kill him, and still manipulating him like that anyway.
I'd have shot him in the head. Don't zombie movies teach us anything :(
yeah i saw that coming the whole time. was hoping it wasnt gonna happen cos i felt pretty sorry for young ben and i got the feeling that sayid did too
Yes~ This episode made me remember why I liked both Ben and Sayid's characters so much.Quote:
Originally Posted by Craig
Overall, I thought the episode was okay (the end was awesome). The whole scene with the "He's Our You" guy (who's name I forgot) was kind of pointless, imho. Lots of the episode seemed like filler.
Now we know who Ilana is, though. What about Caesar?
Well lets see if Faraday is right...
I'm sure we'll learn more about Caesar soon. I'm expecting we'll get flashbacks for each of the O6 to learn more about what they were doing, as we did with Sayid.
who the hell is Caesar?
The Spanish guy who was on the second plane and disagreed with Lapidus's decisions.
Man, I feel sorry for young Ben. Abused by his father, and then putting a lot of effort into helping one of the Hostiles who he thinks will take him away from all that, only to get stabbed in the back. Well, shot in the front, but same difference. No wonder he turned out like he did.
The next episode better have Faraday.
I hear ya.Quote:
Originally Posted by McLovin'
Horace is not a very pretty name
I like his character, though.Quote:
Originally Posted by Levian
Perhaps Ben learned how to manipulate from Sayid, thus Sayid screwed himself and the Losties over.Quote:
Originally Posted by Psychotic
I think it's pretty obvious that Ben turns out the way he does because Sayid tries to kill him. A nice touch of irony there.
I dunno... He already seemed pretty Ben to me. He was lying already, threw a bus on fire into someone's house which could have very much killed them, and he's fully intent on betraying everyone else to make himself happy. Yeah, he's being smacked around by his dad and stuff, but whatever. My childhood wasn't great, but I didn't join the Taliban and try to destroy where I come from over it (okay, they had a truce at the time, I'm stretching). I'm sure getting shot will help the problem along, but Sayid didn't cause his personality to be what it is, I don't think.
But then I find no wrong in anything Sayid does. Fanboy blind and all.
Yeah, Ben has been a bit off ever since he was born > _ > The only people I think he ever really cared for were Alex and Annie, maybe Juliet at some point but I think his love for her was more of a "you're my play thing" obsession or something. I'm curious to know if Annie was killed in the Purge.Quote:
Originally Posted by Noctiluca
ACTUALLY, I read a really interesting theory concerning the whole situation. It suggested that you have to die in order to become the leader of the Others (we already know you have to be willing to kill, or make some sort of "pledge," such as John did with killing his father). Anyway, John's already died and come back to life, but the person who thought up the theory speculates that the reason Ben was so antagonistic towards Sayid after they got off the Island was because he knew Sayid had to go back in time to shoot him in order for him to become the leader of the Others. After all, surely Ben knew Sayid would shoot him in the past regardless if dying is a criteria for becoming the Others' leader.
: OOOOOOQuote:
M. Night Shymalan to direct finale
In a shockingly quiet press release yesterday, executive producers Carlton Cuse and Damon Lindelof, revealed that the director of the series finale would be none other than acclaimed director M. Night Shymalan. The content of the finale still remains a secret, but Lindelof and Cuse stated that they wished to "get a hold" on the most important episode of next year, to make sure that everything goes "without a hitch." Shyamalan, director of such films as The Sixth Sense, Unbreakable, and Lady in the Water says that he is more than up for the challenge, and will begin working with the producers as soon as his newest film, The Last Airbender, completes production.
April Fool's! :spin:
lol april fool's. :monster:
I figured Kate came back mostly for Sawyer since she's all like that. I'm pleasantly surprised it was more to get Aaron's biological mother back.
Hahaha, Jack smurfs up again.
Well, that's what she said. We still don't know if that's entirely true or not.
Best episode this season so far? I'm thinking yes.
Next episode promo looks good.
As long as it has Smokey, life's good.
I think it's a little from column A, a little from column B.Quote:
Originally Posted by Noctiluca
Can't go wrong with 40 minutes of Kate.
and last minute from this episode looked more like a scene from Days of our lives than Lost really.
Hello..... Marlena! [camera zooms in on face] I turned your aunt into a robot goat and inseminated it with your child! [music builds up while maintaining focus on intense facial expression]
Pretty decent for a Kate episode. I like the irony of how Jack refused to operate because of who Ben becomes, but he becomes that way because Jack refused to operate.
The next one looks good too. Perhaps an epic battle between Ben and Smokey is in order. I don't like where (when?) they took this show but at least it's still entertaining.
I hope Jack can redeem himself for all his assiness before the end of this show, cause he's not such a bad character. I liked him in the beginning, I think he kind of had to become the leader from the start and it messed him up towards the end.
Jack was put in a difficult situation with people looking up to him for leadership. Then you got Locke running around acting all weird, plus the presense of the Others and all the other weird crap on the island. He did the best he could with that, and I doubt many could do better. It definitely messed him up and I'm sure he'll get his redemption eventually.
best kate episode so far in this show!
begining to warm up to Myles now! i lol'd at their time travel conversation! Sawyer, Hurley and Juilet are awesome too lol!
Hey, I said mostly, not only :( I reckon she wanted to see Sawyer again and all, but she would not have agreed to go back with only that reason. Needed at least another one iyam.Quote:
Originally Posted by PsychoticI think it's a little from column A, a little from column B.Quote:
Originally Posted by Noctiluca
I honestly want Sawyer to leave Juliet and go for Kate. Why do I wish for such things?
I was kind of confused with the direction they took the narrative when they added in time travel, too, but when you think about it they've been building up to that for the entire series. Adam and Eve are a subtle first indication, other random mentions of experiments with space-time and other physics crap in the Dharma orientation videos, Desmond's future telling abilities (+ Eloise Hawking in season 3 (?) talking to Desmond about course correction, etc.). Not to mention flashbacks / flash forwards, which are signaled in the show very similar to time travel (flash backs / forwards are signaled with that wooshing noise, zoom in on the eye, etc. etc., time travel has the epic screeching + purple noise). Anyway - time travel was very heavily hinted at throughout most of the third and fourth seasons, so by the time it happened, I was sort of assuming it would.Quote:
Originally Posted by Del Murder
can you give some examples of time travel being hinted at in season 3 and 4? dont worry if not, im just curiousQuote:
Originally Posted by Moon RabbitsI was kind of confused with the direction they took the narrative when they added in time travel, too, but when you think about it they've been building up to that for the entire series. Adam and Eve are a subtle first indication, other random mentions of experiments with space-time and other physics crap in the Dharma orientation videos, Desmond's future telling abilities (+ Eloise Hawking in season 3 (?) talking to Desmond about course correction, etc.). Not to mention flashbacks / flash forwards, which are signaled in the show very similar to time travel (flash backs / forwards are signaled with that wooshing noise, zoom in on the eye, etc. etc., time travel has the epic screeching + purple noise). Anyway - time travel was very heavily hinted at throughout most of the third and fourth seasons, so by the time it happened, I was sort of assuming it would.Quote:
Originally Posted by Del Murder
There was that thing in season 3...where desmond could see ahead of time everytime charlie was about to die...and then eliose gave him that speech about time course correcting itself... in season 4 'the constant' episode was a big hint...desmond going back (mentally) to visit faraday...and at the time faraday was making a machine for that mouse that send its mind into the future! then there was that thing with the doctor dying on 'island time' but still alive on 'freighter time'...i think that hinted more about time being smurfed on the island but still.. about time nonetheless lolQuote:
Originally Posted by Craigcan you give some examples of time travel being hinted at in season 3 and 4? dont worry if not, im just curiousQuote:
Originally Posted by Moon RabbitsI was kind of confused with the direction they took the narrative when they added in time travel, too, but when you think about it they've been building up to that for the entire series. Adam and Eve are a subtle first indication, other random mentions of experiments with space-time and other physics crap in the Dharma orientation videos, Desmond's future telling abilities (+ Eloise Hawking in season 3 (?) talking to Desmond about course correction, etc.). Not to mention flashbacks / flash forwards, which are signaled in the show very similar to time travel (flash backs / forwards are signaled with that wooshing noise, zoom in on the eye, etc. etc., time travel has the epic screeching + purple noise). Anyway - time travel was very heavily hinted at throughout most of the third and fourth seasons, so by the time it happened, I was sort of assuming it would.Quote:
Originally Posted by Del Murder
Kate saying goodbye to Aaron was so sad, :(
I loved the bit with the temple, that Temple excites me so
I already gave you many examples. It's been leading up to time travel since the beginning. Season 1 served as an introduction to the characters and the Island, setting it somewhere outside of reality, outside of space. The end of season 1 set up most of the plot for season 2: the Others, Ben, the Hatch, the Numbers, etc. and so on. Season 2 served as an introduction to the stranger properties of the Island and a lot of 'supernatural' phenomena (though, a lot of the supernatural stuff in S2 was scientific physics-ey electro-magnetism crap that all had to do with the hatch). Anyway, S2 ended with Jack+Co. being kidnapped by the Others, so naturally S3 was all about the Others. S3 ends with Naomi reaching the Island (and I believe being killed by Locke?), which leads into S4 which is all about the Freighter people (and Widmore).Quote:
Originally Posted by Craigcan you give some examples of time travel being hinted at in season 3 and 4? dont worry if not, im just curiousQuote:
Originally Posted by Moon RabbitsI was kind of confused with the direction they took the narrative when they added in time travel, too, but when you think about it they've been building up to that for the entire series. Adam and Eve are a subtle first indication, other random mentions of experiments with space-time and other physics crap in the Dharma orientation videos, Desmond's future telling abilities (+ Eloise Hawking in season 3 (?) talking to Desmond about course correction, etc.). Not to mention flashbacks / flash forwards, which are signaled in the show very similar to time travel (flash backs / forwards are signaled with that wooshing noise, zoom in on the eye, etc. etc., time travel has the epic screeching + purple noise). Anyway - time travel was very heavily hinted at throughout most of the third and fourth seasons, so by the time it happened, I was sort of assuming it would.Quote:
Originally Posted by Del Murder
S3 had various hints at time travel and the nature of time in Lost - foremost, as I mentioned before, were Desmond's future-telling abilities. Actually, there was even an instance of actual time travel in S3 (Desmond going back in time, meeting Eloise, who in turn tells him about course correction).
As for S4, how could you miss the references to time travel? They were everywhere. Desmond time travels again, this time through multiple time periods (iirc), Faraday has his machine which he was using to send rats' minds back in time, when Faraday sends for his payload there is a half-hour (or some noticeable time difference) discrepancy between the freighter time and Island time, the doctor on the Freighter washes up dead on the Island but is still alive on the Freighter because of this discrepancy ...
then, Ben "moves" the Island through space-time at the end of S4, which brings us to S5 which is all about time and time travel on the Island.
So yeah, this latest episode was doubleplusgood.
omg epic anyone!?
anything with smokey is awesome lol and dang there was heaps of it!
from what i remember from ancient history (ages ago)...there was a scale that judged you in the underworld...you place your heart in it and if it heavier than a feather then a monster would come eat you up...(sorry abit random but thats all i kept thinking about when those images popped up) how awesome was it that alex was there too lol!
Well, we don't have a word for it John, but we call it...the monster.
That Alex chick has grown a bit since she died.
and that death early in the episode was a bit surprising.
Wow that was great. It was nice to finally see what caused the Ben and Widmore rift.
Also damn, Caesar, didn't see that coming because of how much he was built up, but I laughed when Ben iced him, that was cold. I guess it's all down to Illana then. What the smurf is this secret society crap she has going on? Dharma? Widmore? Somebody else?
Finally, ha, more Egypt references.
Caesar getting blasted was awesome. He was a total douche anyway.
Secret Squirrels.Quote:
Originally Posted by Psychotic
Good call on the Widmore bit. He could have had those people tail Ben and get on the plane to see how he would get back. Except that the girl was taking Sayid into custody, so that's harder to explain.
Favorite episode of the season so far. I forgot why Locke was so awesome, and then I watched this episode and remembered. Caesar's death was pretty damn funny, esp. since I thought he was going to be a main character next season or something. Was it just me, or did anyone else think that Ben wanted the monster to kill him? I mean, it seems like all he really wants is to see his real daughter again (not a crazy monster replica of her) ... and it seems like the monster's decision was more of a punishment than anything else - I think being forced to blindly follow someone is one of the worst things Ben could suffer through, considering his character.
I was a bit let down by the Ben vs. Penny scene ... I wonder why Ben wants Sun to apologize to Desmond? Is it because he tried to kill Penny, or something bigger? Maybe he wound up succeeding ... since, don't you think he would want to apologize to Penny more than Desmond? O - o ??
Yes - that also happens to be Egyptian lore, which the show is obviously drawing a lot of its mythology from. I wonder what the stone carving above the monster's grate that the camera focused so long on means. It looked like Anubis ... and the other thing sort of looked like the monster, but with a face.Quote:
Originally Posted by *ETERNAL FANTASY*
Widmore knows how to get to and from the Island - Ben mentioned in a flashback that Widmore broke "the rules" by leaving the Island multiple times, and having a child with an "outsider" (afaik Penny's mother hasn't been revealed ...). Though, I think they may be talking about someone other than Penny perhaps? I still think Penny is Eloise Hawkings' daughter > _ >Quote:
Originally Posted by Flying MulletCaesar getting blasted was awesome. He was a total douche anyway.
Secret Squirrels.Quote:
Originally Posted by Psychotic
Good call on the Widmore bit. He could have had those people tail Ben and get on the plane to see how he would get back. Except that the girl was taking Sayid into custody, so that's harder to explain.
ANYWAY ! It's already been established that Ilana is working for Widmore. I think that Widmore's original plan was to kill the O6 off of the Island so that they couldn't get back and fix whatever it is they have to fix. I don't think he anticipated that Ilana and Sayid would be on the same plane ... or did he? That would make sense, too, since it gives him an "inside (wo)man" on the Island. And is Widmore still in contact with Eloise? It was insinuated in the last episode that they had some sort of relationship (perhaps not an emotional relationship, but they were both spoken of by the Others' as higher-ups when the injured young Ben was brought to them).
Oh, and Ethan becomes one of the Others after the Purge ... so does that mean that Annie, perhaps, became one too? Or did she die in the Purge? I want to know ; - ;
Also, here's a major major major major major major spoiler concerning Jacob, read at your own rissssssk:
(SPOILER) Jacob was present at several defining moments in the survivors' lives:
he was at Sawyer's parents' funeral, Jin and Sun's wedding, Nadia's death, and was reading a book across the street when Locke was thrown from Anthony Cooper's window. They've also hired an actor to play Jacob already, which means he will appear before the end of S5 ... I forgot his name though >_>
Because Ben shot Desmond at the dock when he was approaching Penny.Quote:
Originally Posted by Moon Rabbits
But I think Widmore was using the sub to do that. Since Locke blew up the sub, the only apparent way onto the island was cut off. I think Ben called Charles not only to tell him he was going to kill Penny but to also gloat over the fact that he found another way onto the island after Widmore spent 20 years trying without any success.Quote:
Originally Posted by Moon Rabbits
Ooooooooh, yeah, you're right. Before he attacks Penny, he specifically mentions that to Widmore. Also: Ilana actually states she was working for the family of the golf course guy that Sayid killed way back, which means she isn't technically working for Widmore (though, the golf course guy was employed by Widmore). I think Ilana might be working for Dharma, actually .....Quote:
Originally Posted by Flying MulletBecause Ben shot Desmond at the dock when he was approaching Penny.Quote:
Originally Posted by Moon Rabbits
But I think Widmore was using the sub to do that. Since Locke blew up the sub, the only apparent way onto the island was cut off. I think Ben called Charles not only to tell him he was going to kill Penny but to also gloat over the fact that he found another way onto the island after Widmore spent 20 years trying without any success.Quote:
Originally Posted by Moon Rabbits
I love Ben episodes. This was a great one. The way he lies with so much confidence is beautiful. 'I thought something like this might happen John, that was the point'. Later to Sun...'I had no idea this would happen, and it scares the crap out of me.'
Best part was Desmond out of nowhere kicking Ben's ass. I was so mad because I thought Desmond was being randomly killed off. I'm glad his family ended up ok, someone needs to have a happy ending on this show.
Ben + smoke monster = awesome, as many have already said.
Ben and Locke have such a great dynamic already, and now Ben has to be his lackey. This will be much amusement. What's happening with the 'main group' in the 70s is not nearly as interesting as what is happening in the present.
The timeline doesn't make sense though. The Purge happened in 1992. And this episode has little Ethan in it which means its after 1992. But when Ben took little Alex, she was only like at least a year old. So that would mean its 1988 not 1992...so is this a big continuity error or am I missing something?
Where does it say the purge happened in 1992?
"The exact year the Purge occurred was not mentioned during Ben's flashback in "The Man Behind the Curtain"; however, Horace Goodspeed told Locke in a dream that he had been dead for twelve years. Assuming that this is correct, it places the Purge in 1992"
'Time works differently on the island.'
Bam, there's your cop-out response I bet. :D
Wow! That episode was pure awesome. Things are finally starting to come together after so much work. I think the people who abandoned Lost are gonna regret it by the end of the last season :)
Great episode.
Hadn't Locke given the impression he was not going to bring Sun back in accordance with Jin's wishes? My memory is totally :bou::bou::bou::bou:, so I could be remembering this wrong, but I don't think he even approached her at all for this reason. I thought Locke would be pissed that Sun was back, but there was no reaction to it.
Ethan could have defected just as Ben did prior to the Purge. Perhaps that explains why Ethan's last name is "Rom" and not "Goodspeed."Quote:
Originally Posted by McLovin'
Also, I hope everyone noticed the significance of the name of Penny and Desmond's boat!
Of course. I'm sure that'll tie into the plot sooner or later.
What was the name? I tried to look when I was watching but it was too pixelated.
I couldnt read the name either...
Checked lostpedia. I thought "our mutual friend" was just Ben talking about Penny. :p apparently it's some book Desmond has been carrying around.
looking back I think Exposé is easily my favorite episode since Season 2. :D
Our Mutual Friend is the name of the boat. I think.
Wasn't Ethan born in 1977? If the kidnapping took place after the purge, he'd have been at least 22, and he looked younger. Ben also looks younger in that scene than during the purge, so I'm gonna go out on a limb and say it happened before it. Perhaps the two would often sneak away at night or at weekends to the Others.
Matthew Fox, duh! :roll2Quote:
Originally Posted by Moon Rabbits
Our Mutual Friend was the name of the boat, and it was the Dickens book that Desmond said would be the last thing he ever read while in the Hatch.
And Psy, the Purge was in '92, not '99, we're basically sure of. We know it occurred after February of '91 (Kelvin Inman was in the Army during the First Gulf War and was in the Swan, locked away, at the time of the Purge), and yeah, Horace said it was in '92. Even then, I don't think that Ethan was 15 yet. He looked more around 11-12, which would fit with it occurring in '88 or '89.
Yeah, I'm pretty sure that's how a lot of things are going to be explained by the end of the series > _ > ie. Ethan's age ... but maybe the actor just didn't look 15 o_ OQuote:
Originally Posted by Del Murder
Mikhail said that the Purge was the result of DHARMA initiating "war" against the Others. Who wants to bet that Sawyer + co. had everything to do with it?
YouTube - Lost Timeline Theorie - Main theory - (1 of 3)
This theory on Lost is really great if you want to watch it.
Another awesome episode, I thought. Miles is becoming one of my favourite characters.
Anyone thinking that Older Miles it responsible for saving younger miles and his mom from the Purge?
Yup yup, that's what we were thinking when he was watching his dad and his baby self reading that book.
I doubt it. For one, Miles knows that whatever happened, happened, and that he DIDN'T die in the Purge (which is 15 years from now), so I don't think he's going to worry about it. His dad kicks his wife and son out of the house when they're young, and so they leave. She didn't leave him.Quote:
Originally Posted by McLovin'
So, the folks who took Miles for a ride aren't Widmore. Are they DHARMA?
Filler episode~ although Hurley writing Empire Strikes Back was lol worthy.
The 70s episodes remind me of when the group was split up before and JKS was on that other island with the Others. Man those episodes were boring.
I don't think those people were Dharma, but if they were it would mean his father could be alive. They probably work for Ben.
They can't work for Ben since they didn't seem to talk to him on the plane.
Unless they're supposed to ignore him... :shifty:
Oh that guy in the car was on the second plane?
He's one of the guys that took over the crate when Frank gets back and they ask him about the shadow of the statue and then knock him out.
in the shadow of the statue lies the smoke monster
random crack pot theory i just came up with in 0.5 seconds:
the statue they mean is the big egyptian one and there is something near there that wouldve been covered by its shadow at a certain point if it were still standing and that something has shown these people "the truth" about something, which if frank, miles or anyone else had seen they would know too which is why they asked them that, cos if frank etc had seen it theyd be on the same level as those ppl then theyd be on the same side
makes no sense dont worry
I think the statue used to be where ben went to confront the smoke monster?
The statue's on the coastline. When Sayid and others were sailing around the island when they believed The Others were camped on the beach to save Walt, they saw the four-toed foot, all that remains of the statue. Then we saw the whole statue from the back at a distance when the Losties that remained on the island were jumping around in time travel.
The statue and the shadow of it plus that gang of crazies is all to do with the Egyptian crap. You wait and see!
Ah your right.Quote:
Originally Posted by Flying Mullet
Well duh.Quote:
Originally Posted by Psychotic
So, the folks who took Miles for a ride aren't Widmore. Are they DHARMA?[/QUOTE]
Nah I think McLovin's theory is plausible. I'm thinking the way Harry saved himself in Prisoner of Azkaban - he finally realised no one else was going to do it, he had to do it himself. That's the way it'll be if it happens, mark my words. I'm also certain the story Miles' mother told him is wrong - she lied about Pierre not caring about them, so odds of her having lied about other stuff as well are pretty high.Quote:
Originally Posted by KirobaitoI doubt it. For one, Miles knows that whatever happened, happened, and that he DIDN'T die in the Purge (which is 15 years from now), so I don't think he's going to worry about it. His dad kicks his wife and son out of the house when they're young, and so they leave. She didn't leave him.Quote:
Originally Posted by McLovin'
That actually sounds plausible to me. Though I also think it's probably a secret password. I agree with Kirobaito that these people are probably associated with the remains of the Dharma Initiative.Quote:
Originally Posted by Craig
Good eppy. Didn't reveal much we didn't already know cept for what the Swan's true purpose was.
Best episode this season and I've loved all episodes this season so far.Season finale is going to blow our brains. With one more season left after this one has to wonder what will happen either way, fail or succeed, what's going to happen?And what's in the shadow of the statue?! What's with the egyptian hieroglyphs, where does the energy come from, what is the island really!?
God, I love this show, the temporal gymnastics, and all it's character's fracked up parental issues.
God damn. That was good television. Everything Eloise did with Daniel throughout his life, you realise why. To try to change :bou::bou::bou::bou: by pushing him as hard as possible to be the best he can be. But she also knows it could backfire and she could be the one pushing him to his doom at her hands. Thus "For the first time, I don't know what is going to happen" to Penny. Daniel's Variable theory and all that. Which is weird as she seemed like such a huge believer in "whatever happened, happened", that phrase they all keep throwing around.
I love the episodes leading up to Lost finales. You can see the slow and unstoppable descent into insanity gradually building up and it's fantastic.
EDIT: Holy :bou::bou::bou::bou: I just realised Faraday is the guy from Saving Private Ryan. Man, I knew I'd seen him somewhere before.
Great episode, possibly even better than the Ben-centric one a few weeks ago. (SPOILER)man, Faraday had a bleak existence though, didn't he? Methinks his final thoughts would've been about how his bright ideas about changing everything resulted in nothing being changed, and how his own mother raised him so austerely knowing that she'd end up inadvertently killing him as a direct result of him traveling back to the past. I kind of think he almost had to do go back there for the sake of not smurfing up everything massively though, since if he didn't go back to 1953 then the H-bomb would probably explode, killing everyone and creating a time paradox.
though it's possible Eloise was just hoping that if she raised him well enough he'd be able to change :bou::bou::bou::bou:, but who knows really. Maybe we'll find out more in future episodes.
Anyway yeah, definitely one of the best this season so far.
So what was Daniel doing on the mainland for 3 years?
Lost sure loves to kill off the newer characters.
Hiding from Charlotte. He shouldn't have talked to her, really, because until he did, he was invulnerable.Quote:
Originally Posted by Del Murder
Look out, Miles! I'm pretty sure they added the tail section folks just to kill them. Looking back on it, they had absolutely no bearing on anything whatsoever.Quote:
Lost sure loves to kill off the newer characters.
The producers and writers said they strayed from the original story idea in season two. I wonder if the tail section was purely a ratings grab that backfired. The only way the tail would tie in is if Rose and Bernard are Adam and Eve or Bernard has some impact on the story still.
I'm still convinced Rose and Bernard are going to end up being Adam and Eve. I also think they originally planned to do more with Libby's character until her actor got a DUI, but I also think we may still end up seeing her again through Hurley at some point. Though I think I remember someone saying Darlton claimed we wouldn't, but I don't remember if they had a source on that.
I thought I read somewhere a year or two ago that we would see more of Libby, but we haven't, if I'm remembering correctly.
And yes, a DUI is a character write-off on Lost.
They said Libby's story was done and there was no need to show more of her.
Quote:
Originally Posted by Lostpedia
Desmond's actor is in a spot of legal bother after apparently groping and motorboating a female crew member on the Lost set. So Desmond is probably going to get shot or catapulted into the sun or something now. :(
MOST UPSETTING EPISODE EVER.
Really. Daniel added so much to the show. I wanted his character to stay alive, but I'm really impressed with how the writers played him out.
Juliet + Sawyer = captured by Dharma. I can't wait to see how that plays out.
Also: I think the producers are lying about Libby's story being finished. She worked for Widmore, toooooootally. Speaking of the Tailies - Bernard isn't the only surviving one. Cindy is alive and living with the Others.
I think we were supposed to forget about Cindy. Not that she'll come back for a surprise, but that she was a bit character who's gone from the show.
Great episode! Cant stand Jack though!
I actually watched the Taillies episode the other day and wondered about the possible return of Cindy. But I think I agree with Mullet. Even among the Taillies she was a pretty minor character, and the likes of Nathan and Goodwin got more screen time.
So, according to Wikipedia, the central character for this week's episode is (SPOILER)Richard Alpert.
SMURF. YES.
Holy :bou::bou::bou::bou:, awesome. Been waiting for that one for a loooong time.
smurf YOU KATE!!! I was sooooo pissed when she got on the sub.
Also, little scrawny guy hitting Juliet :eek: I really hope James gets to kill him.
It's so sad that when the doctor was asking Hugo those time related questions, I couldn't come up with answers on the spot either.
Anyway, good episode. Really hoping Jacob makes a genuine appearance in the finale. All I needed is more Sayid, little as it was. I've been missing him hardcore. As for Kate and Jack, I'm honestly not entirely sure which way I would go on the matter.
I would've gone with Nixon on the spot. And I would've been ever so slightly wrong. But hey ask me who the British Prime Minister was in '77 and I would correctly say James Callaghan and none of you have even heard of him so don't judge me. :colbert:
Was hoping this Richard episode would've explained his past (I wonder if he is associated with the Black Rock! Or Egypt! Or both! Or is he from the future and is Aaron and Yi Jeon's child? WHO KNOWS) but eh it'll do. My face was like Ben's when Locke revealed his grand plan.
This. *nod*Quote:
Originally Posted by Psychotic
And judging by the preview, she somehow messes up possibly the best relationship Sawyer's ever had.Quote:
Originally Posted by Moon Rabbits
And the "Jack is Jacob" theory is starting to become more plausible seeing how he's beginning to believe in "fate" and "destiny." I guess we'll find out next week. :)
Maybe Jack causes the Incident by taking the explosive parts of the H-Bomb to the Swan Site hence emulsifying the pocket of energy which originally discharged. Just a thought.
Though all of DHARMA are gone and its pre-Purge so maybe they did change things?
Or they came back of course...
My wife's following the theory that Locke is actually dead and Jacob inhabits or borrows dead bodies to interact with the inhabitants of the island. This is why Locke, Christian, Claire and Mr. Eko's brother's characters all act differently and omnipotent after they are dead. This is also why no one has ever seen Jacob, as he doesn't have a tangible form. Currently Jacob is using Locke's body and he is testing Richard and Ben when he told Ben that they are headed off to kill Jacob.
I still don't understand why Sun stuck around while all the rest went back in time, other than the fact that the writers wanted to build up to a Jin Sun reunion some time in the future.
Also why would detonating an a-bomb cause everything to get 'fixed'? Jack's lost it and I'm pretty sure Sayid went along to stop him.
The thought process is that if the bomb detonates then the magnetic energy is never released from the drilling and the bomb neutralizes that energy. Thus the plane never crashes in the future if the bomb goes off and everyone wakes up in a new timeline where the plane never crashed. Similar to the parallel timelines they used in Back to the Future 2 where Biff gave himself that sports book and became a billionaire in the alternate 1985.
The contradiction comes in because they've stated that you can't change the past, but what if an action you perform in the past effects your past and future?